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	<title>Comments on: How Will the Left Deal With Victory in Iraq?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/</link>
	<description>Where Defeat Is Not An Option</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 03:39:14 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Jimmyjon Jones</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59907</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimmyjon Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59907</guid>
		<description>Victory? The most recent stories I have been reading indicate terrible defeat.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080617/ap_on_re_as/afghanistan_6</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Victory? The most recent stories I have been reading indicate terrible defeat.</p>
<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080617/ap_on_re_as/afghanistan_6" rel="nofollow">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080617/ap_on_re_as/afghanistan_6</a></p>
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		<title>By: cam</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59451</link>
		<dc:creator>cam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 04:00:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59451</guid>
		<description>Victory? What victory?  Its like you moved the goal post to your own 15 yard line, kicked a short field goal and then prepared for victory.  Can any of you who yearn for "victory" in Iraq please define what that looks like.  When things were going poorlly in Iraq you asked for patience.  Now that we have seen a relatively short period of calm you are ready to put up another "Mission Accomplished" proclomation.

What I as a liberal am afraid of is not of victory but rather a public relations campaign that calls it victory - a "victory" that can be used as a back drop for John McCain or the next presidential candidate with an R next to his name, a victory that leads to the bankrupting of our economy or leads to a failed state like the victory in Afganistan that lead to the Taliban in Afganistan.

On another point, when are you going to give the "at least Bush has kept us safe".  Just because two things occur in close proximaty does not mean there is a relationship between the two.  Keep in mind that at the same point  in the Clinton presidency, a second attack had not yet occured, quite similar to the Bush presidency.  Just because Bush spent billions and called it the war on terrorism does not mean there is any causation between the two events.  Ultimately, if another attack occurs on US soil the response from conservatives will entirely depend on who becomes president this fall.  If it is McCain, the attack will be blamed on the Democrats in congress.  If its Obama you will blame him evern if it occurs on January 21, 2009.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Victory? What victory?  Its like you moved the goal post to your own 15 yard line, kicked a short field goal and then prepared for victory.  Can any of you who yearn for &#8220;victory&#8221; in Iraq please define what that looks like.  When things were going poorlly in Iraq you asked for patience.  Now that we have seen a relatively short period of calm you are ready to put up another &#8220;Mission Accomplished&#8221; proclomation.</p>
<p>What I as a liberal am afraid of is not of victory but rather a public relations campaign that calls it victory - a &#8220;victory&#8221; that can be used as a back drop for John McCain or the next presidential candidate with an R next to his name, a victory that leads to the bankrupting of our economy or leads to a failed state like the victory in Afganistan that lead to the Taliban in Afganistan.</p>
<p>On another point, when are you going to give the &#8220;at least Bush has kept us safe&#8221;.  Just because two things occur in close proximaty does not mean there is a relationship between the two.  Keep in mind that at the same point  in the Clinton presidency, a second attack had not yet occured, quite similar to the Bush presidency.  Just because Bush spent billions and called it the war on terrorism does not mean there is any causation between the two events.  Ultimately, if another attack occurs on US soil the response from conservatives will entirely depend on who becomes president this fall.  If it is McCain, the attack will be blamed on the Democrats in congress.  If its Obama you will blame him evern if it occurs on January 21, 2009.</p>
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		<title>By: neocon</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59141</link>
		<dc:creator>neocon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 12:50:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59141</guid>
		<description>Vicodin,

By all means, stay exactly where you're at. We have plenty of useful idiots up here.

I do wonder why you continue to post here with us "malecudados" Americanos? Why? You seem to be awfully obssessed with that of which you have left behind. Psycho-therapists would have a field day with that. Time to move on, son. 

But if you insist, keep your posts short. I don't care what you think or do. Because I consider South Americans dirty, smelly and bad sexual partners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Vicodin,</p>
<p>By all means, stay exactly where you&#8217;re at. We have plenty of useful idiots up here.</p>
<p>I do wonder why you continue to post here with us &#8220;malecudados&#8221; Americanos? Why? You seem to be awfully obssessed with that of which you have left behind. Psycho-therapists would have a field day with that. Time to move on, son. </p>
<p>But if you insist, keep your posts short. I don&#8217;t care what you think or do. Because I consider South Americans dirty, smelly and bad sexual partners.</p>
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		<title>By: Kahn</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59061</link>
		<dc:creator>Kahn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 06:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59061</guid>
		<description>Timothy,

Good thing the French didn't blockade the British at Yorktown. Or supply us with arms. Oh wait, they did.

Hey look, my example wasn't even hypothetical. Maybe you should read more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Timothy,</p>
<p>Good thing the French didn&#8217;t blockade the British at Yorktown. Or supply us with arms. Oh wait, they did.</p>
<p>Hey look, my example wasn&#8217;t even hypothetical. Maybe you should read more.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Horrigan</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59051</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Horrigan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 05:27:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59051</guid>
		<description>As I recall, when we won victory over Saddam Hussein, the left said we should pull our troops out and send in UN peacekeepers.  The fact is, we DID win victory over Saddam.  It was a victory which was not worth the cost, but we did win.

Whatever the hell it is we are doing now, it can't end in victory.  Because, it is impossible to win some other country's civil war.  Our current situation is kinda as if in 1859 the Brits had invaded the USA and overthrown President Buchanan.  There would be no way for them to win the conflict which would have followed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I recall, when we won victory over Saddam Hussein, the left said we should pull our troops out and send in UN peacekeepers.  The fact is, we DID win victory over Saddam.  It was a victory which was not worth the cost, but we did win.</p>
<p>Whatever the hell it is we are doing now, it can&#8217;t end in victory.  Because, it is impossible to win some other country&#8217;s civil war.  Our current situation is kinda as if in 1859 the Brits had invaded the USA and overthrown President Buchanan.  There would be no way for them to win the conflict which would have followed.</p>
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		<title>By: SEW</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59042</link>
		<dc:creator>SEW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 04:46:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59042</guid>
		<description>"They’ll have a weiner roast with all of GI JOE and BLACKWATER’s dicks"  Vicodin


Arse, enjoy your vicodin, cocoa, and girlfriend.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;They’ll have a weiner roast with all of GI JOE and BLACKWATER’s dicks&#8221;  Vicodin</p>
<p>Arse, enjoy your vicodin, cocoa, and girlfriend.</p>
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		<title>By: SEW</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59014</link>
		<dc:creator>SEW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 03:00:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59014</guid>
		<description>"I’d rather be the lid on a garbage can in Manizales than be the Emperor Of Flag Pin Town. "
Vicodin

You seem quite successful with that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’d rather be the lid on a garbage can in Manizales than be the Emperor Of Flag Pin Town. &#8221;<br />
Vicodin</p>
<p>You seem quite successful with that.</p>
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		<title>By: SEW</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59003</link>
		<dc:creator>SEW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 02:12:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59003</guid>
		<description>"Not his fault you guys are stuck in the Middle Class. Where’d you all go wrong? high school? Didn’t take enough math thought all those musically inclined kids were fags weren’t really athletically talented enough for college sports? Mediocre jobs average looking spuses no drugs no kink Groundhog Day existences where one would welcome a wild swinging Paradise to mundane old Terra."   Robin

Mushrooms again or your normal mental state?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Not his fault you guys are stuck in the Middle Class. Where’d you all go wrong? high school? Didn’t take enough math thought all those musically inclined kids were fags weren’t really athletically talented enough for college sports? Mediocre jobs average looking spuses no drugs no kink Groundhog Day existences where one would welcome a wild swinging Paradise to mundane old Terra.&#8221;   Robin</p>
<p>Mushrooms again or your normal mental state?</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremiah</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59001</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremiah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 01:58:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-59001</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Their weaponry is the same as yours.&lt;/i&gt;

Surely SA don't have F-14 TOMCATS ... do they?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Their weaponry is the same as yours.</i></p>
<p>Surely SA don&#8217;t have F-14 TOMCATS &#8230; do they?</p>
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		<title>By: Vicodin-N-Cocoa</title>
		<link>http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-58997</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicodin-N-Cocoa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 01:40:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogsforvictory.com/2008/06/14/how-will-the-left-deal-with-victory-in-iraq/#comment-58997</guid>
		<description>NeoCon:

I'd rather be the lid on a garbage can in Manizales than be the Emperor Of Flag Pin Town.  So, don't worry about that.

Which South American is trying to go to America, exactly? I don't expect you to know the difference, but which South American country's people are emigrating to the US or want to?  The answer is: none.

You think my macroeconomic views are so naive? OK.  Fair enough.  I assume you're intelligent enough to go to Bloomberg or Reuters or Dow Jones.  Go to the foreign exchange section and do a 7 year chart of any South American country's currencies against the USD at purchasing power parity.  Find me one which has appreciated LESS than 200% against the USD. There are none because the cost of holding dollars to a South American is too high.  There's an 11% real interest carry.

These people you disdain so much are wealthier than you are.  They have no reason to want to live in the US.  Your country is a laughing stock.  They say the USA is a communist dictatorship.  They say that the funniest thing about the USA is that the two things you think your great at you suck at: War and Business.

They say that you are "asquerosos" ("nauseating"), "maleducados" ("impolite"), "saposos" ("innocent fools") and for the life of them they can't understand why you are all so fat when we have the same products in the supermarkets that you do.

Go out clubbing with a bunch of friends and everybody can do a John McCain impression with a cloth napkin to create the distorted disfigured face and the crippled hands trying in vain to grab a glass of ice water, and the mean grimace and the high pitched squeaky voice.  It is pretty funny, you have to admit.

He is kind of a geek.

But I take McStonehands at his word that he'll come down here and invade Venezuela, Ecuador and Bolivia.  His GI JOES won't get to try.  They're supposed to use Colombia as a staging area, but the problem is that despite having a president who is sympathetic to the Bush/McCain cause, they too have a red state/blue state kind of thing and it's just like it is in the US.  While the interior is all for Uribe, the cities are all for Gaviria.

But they can't very well use Colombia as a "staging area" for an incursion into Venezuela without locking down Bogota, Cali, and Medellin, all about the size of Bagdad.

I assume you're not familiar with any of this so I'll tell you what's going on.  There has been 40 years of poltical violence over who controls the cocaine and which banks launder the money.  The people are not to be trifled with.

Let's say GI JOE decides he'll take over the Jewish or Arab neighborhood in Cali.  The Jews and Arabs there don't fight.  They consider each other to be Semite cousins and they have a ton of money and private armies.  So, let's say GI JOE comes upon three upper-class Jewish teenage girls near the country-club in Cali.  What neither you or GI JOE understand is that though these are White rich girls with body piercings and Amy Winehouse t-shirts and cellphones, they've all seen their fathers, brothers, male cousins blown to bits by rival cartels or the paramiltaries by the time their 10 years old.  They're not stupid they know what's going on and they look at ("thanks for your service") GI JOE and they really couldn't care less if GI JOE loves his country and Jesus and has a flag pin and his mother in Indiana bakes cherry pie.   They just want the gringos to go away -- like -- now.  GI JOE gives them a big American smile , probably thinking he'll get a blowjob from one of them.  They call their uncle on the other side of the golf course. Tell him what's happening.  He gets the private army ready.

Then, GI JOE passes and one or more of these innocent looking teenage girls takes pistol out of her little purse and blows GI JOE'S head into red mist.  Poor GI JOE.

Now, it's not that they're evil girls, it's that they're affectless from all the violence they've seen since childhood.  Their families tell them if you see someone in a uniform don't waste a second just kill him.   They go to private school.  They have proms and bar mitzvahs and all that stuff.  They just don't care about strangers' lives.

Now, tell me, if that's what it's like in the fancy part of Cali, what's GI JOE going to do when he tries to secure the ghettoes of Cali?

And Colombia is your ally, remember?  The goal is to conquer Chavez in Venezuela.  Good luck, GI JOE.  They have an army of 800,000 men.  They sure don't need roadside bombs and rocks to throw.  Their weaponry is the same as yours.  The oil wealth in that country is staggering.  It's a toss-up at even strength.  Outnumbered 8-to-1? Are you nuts, man?

They'll have a weiner roast with all of GI JOE and BLACKWATER's dicks.

But we know how much McCain loves war, so he'll send in another 100,000 lambs to the slaughter.  Not my problem.  My son'll be safe. It'll be your son doing the dying.

But you can't have Barack Obama as president.  He just wants to carry over whatever leases American companies have.  Send a wire.  Take delivery at NY Harbor.  Thank you very much.  See you next month.  Bye.

Listen it's old cripply geeky McCain stone hands who wants your kids to die for fun.  Not Obama.  Obama just wants to pay market price for the crude and be done with it.

I thought you said that Black people weren't as smart as White people.  What am I mssing here?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NeoCon:</p>
<p>I&#8217;d rather be the lid on a garbage can in Manizales than be the Emperor Of Flag Pin Town.  So, don&#8217;t worry about that.</p>
<p>Which South American is trying to go to America, exactly? I don&#8217;t expect you to know the difference, but which South American country&#8217;s people are emigrating to the US or want to?  The answer is: none.</p>
<p>You think my macroeconomic views are so naive? OK.  Fair enough.  I assume you&#8217;re intelligent enough to go to Bloomberg or Reuters or Dow Jones.  Go to the foreign exchange section and do a 7 year chart of any South American country&#8217;s currencies against the USD at purchasing power parity.  Find me one which has appreciated LESS than 200% against the USD. There are none because the cost of holding dollars to a South American is too high.  There&#8217;s an 11% real interest carry.</p>
<p>These people you disdain so much are wealthier than you are.  They have no reason to want to live in the US.  Your country is a laughing stock.  They say the USA is a communist dictatorship.  They say that the funniest thing about the USA is that the two things you think your great at you suck at: War and Business.</p>
<p>They say that you are &#8220;asquerosos&#8221; (&#8221;nauseating&#8221;), &#8220;maleducados&#8221; (&#8221;impolite&#8221;), &#8220;saposos&#8221; (&#8221;innocent fools&#8221;) and for the life of them they can&#8217;t understand why you are all so fat when we have the same products in the supermarkets that you do.</p>
<p>Go out clubbing with a bunch of friends and everybody can do a John McCain impression with a cloth napkin to create the distorted disfigured face and the crippled hands trying in vain to grab a glass of ice water, and the mean grimace and the high pitched squeaky voice.  It is pretty funny, you have to admit.</p>
<p>He is kind of a geek.</p>
<p>But I take McStonehands at his word that he&#8217;ll come down here and invade Venezuela, Ecuador and Bolivia.  His GI JOES won&#8217;t get to try.  They&#8217;re supposed to use Colombia as a staging area, but the problem is that despite having a president who is sympathetic to the Bush/McCain cause, they too have a red state/blue state kind of thing and it&#8217;s just like it is in the US.  While the interior is all for Uribe, the cities are all for Gaviria.</p>
<p>But they can&#8217;t very well use Colombia as a &#8220;staging area&#8221; for an incursion into Venezuela without locking down Bogota, Cali, and Medellin, all about the size of Bagdad.</p>
<p>I assume you&#8217;re not familiar with any of this so I&#8217;ll tell you what&#8217;s going on.  There has been 40 years of poltical violence over who controls the cocaine and which banks launder the money.  The people are not to be trifled with.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s say GI JOE decides he&#8217;ll take over the Jewish or Arab neighborhood in Cali.  The Jews and Arabs there don&#8217;t fight.  They consider each other to be Semite cousins and they have a ton of money and private armies.  So, let&#8217;s say GI JOE comes upon three upper-class Jewish teenage girls near the country-club in Cali.  What neither you or GI JOE understand is that though these are White rich girls with body piercings and Amy Winehouse t-shirts and cellphones, they&#8217;ve all seen their fathers, brothers, male cousins blown to bits by rival cartels or the paramiltaries by the time their 10 years old.  They&#8217;re not stupid they know what&#8217;s going on and they look at (&#8221;thanks for your service&#8221;) GI JOE and they really couldn&#8217;t care less if GI JOE loves his country and Jesus and has a flag pin and his mother in Indiana bakes cherry pie.   They just want the gringos to go away &#8212; like &#8212; now.  GI JOE gives them a big American smile , probably thinking he&#8217;ll get a blowjob from one of them.  They call their uncle on the other side of the golf course. Tell him what&#8217;s happening.  He gets the private army ready.</p>
<p>Then, GI JOE passes and one or more of these innocent looking teenage girls takes pistol out of her little purse and blows GI JOE&#8217;S head into red mist.  Poor GI JOE.</p>
<p>Now, it&#8217;s not that they&#8217;re evil girls, it&#8217;s that they&#8217;re affectless from all the violence they&#8217;ve seen since childhood.  Their families tell them if you see someone in a uniform don&#8217;t waste a second just kill him.   They go to private school.  They have proms and bar mitzvahs and all that stuff.  They just don&#8217;t care about strangers&#8217; lives.</p>
<p>Now, tell me, if that&#8217;s what it&#8217;s like in the fancy part of Cali, what&#8217;s GI JOE going to do when he tries to secure the ghettoes of Cali?</p>
<p>And Colombia is your ally, remember?  The goal is to conquer Chavez in Venezuela.  Good luck, GI JOE.  They have an army of 800,000 men.  They sure don&#8217;t need roadside bombs and rocks to throw.  Their weaponry is the same as yours.  The oil wealth in that country is staggering.  It&#8217;s a toss-up at even strength.  Outnumbered 8-to-1? Are you nuts, man?</p>
<p>They&#8217;ll have a weiner roast with all of GI JOE and BLACKWATER&#8217;s dicks.</p>
<p>But we know how much McCain loves war, so he&#8217;ll send in another 100,000 lambs to the slaughter.  Not my problem.  My son&#8217;ll be safe. It&#8217;ll be your son doing the dying.</p>
<p>But you can&#8217;t have Barack Obama as president.  He just wants to carry over whatever leases American companies have.  Send a wire.  Take delivery at NY Harbor.  Thank you very much.  See you next month.  Bye.</p>
<p>Listen it&#8217;s old cripply geeky McCain stone hands who wants your kids to die for fun.  Not Obama.  Obama just wants to pay market price for the crude and be done with it.</p>
<p>I thought you said that Black people weren&#8217;t as smart as White people.  What am I mssing here?</p>
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