soma watson next day no rx required

Obama said - definitively - that the surge wouldn’t work and, indeed, would make things worse; Obama’s counter-proposal to the surge was to propose a law which would have started our withdrawal immediately and which have got the last US soldier out three months ago.

You can try to say all you want that I’m being shameful - but you really need to think about this, extra: Obama said it would fail; his people are not trying to sell the story that he didn’t say that…he was either lying in 2007, or he’s lying now. Pick one. There’s no third option.

“44 percent of Iraqis feel that their country is headed in the right direction. On the other hand, only 17 percent of Americans feel the same way.

The difference here being, in November 73% of Americans will think the country is now headed in the right direction. 56% of Iraqi’s (of the ones that are still living or in country. This is including the ones that have been bribed) will most likely still think their country is headed in the wrong direction.

Today’s lesson, America is a Democracy and free nation. Iraq, functioned better under Saddam and is currently a political nightmare and war zone. But lets continue to compare stats because like Ann Coulter says, Baghdad is similar to the proverbial ghetto in the US.

No, I said your attempt to categorize the US government paying off militias as “political progress by the Iraqis” is really stupid. Step up your reading comprehension, please.

And Noonan, why am I not surprised that you prefer burying your head in the sand and sticking with your laughable talking points to acknowledging reality? Are you seriously arguing that we aren’t paying off militias? That ethnic cleansing hasn’t happened? That millions of Iraqis have been displaced? That neighborhoods are barracaded and segregated? That the Iraqi security forces have been heavily infiltrated by insurgents, meaning that other insurgents don’t attack because they aren’t keen on killing their fellow insurgents?

You are seriously arguing all that. This is one of the many reasons why nobody outside the handful of wingnut cranks on this site takes you at all seriously about Iraq: You prefer political spin to actual facts. I mean, why bother learning anything–or even correcting your more egregious errors–when you can simply parrot the line that “the surge is working!” no matter what the circumstances (remember when an increase in violence also meant the surge was working? Good times…), say that anybody who thinks otherwise just wants America to lose, and consider that well-reasoned analysis?

Just to put things in perspective, I’m not now, nor have I ever been in the camp with those who want to “pull out now”. I was against going there in the first place, but now that we broke it, we have a moral obligation to fix it - even if it does take 100 years. And, I think it’s good that the violence has waned, regardless of any political implications positive or negative.

With regard to this thread, I merely wish to say I don’t think there is enough evidence here to call Obama a liar. Even that “gotcha” video you pointed me to isn’t quite comparing apples to apples. I know that Mark takes being called a liar very seriously, but doesn’t apply the same standards in calling his enemies liars - the accusations fly around quite liberally in his zeal to denigrate the evil, godless, unpatriotic left. Honestly, I’m quite sure he feels that everybody on the left is a liar, since by his definition they don’t understand the Truth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4vlBgh7KLg&feature=related

But you didn’t actually read it or listen to it, you’re just sure it MUST be there? Kool-aide tastes great in the morning, doesn’t it?

Where in that statement do you hear Susan Rice claiming “Obama always said the “troop surge” would work”? That snippet, even if taken out of context, says nothing of the sort. And that’s what you hold out a sufficient evidence to call a man a liar?

I’m sure if you were to find more of that transcript, you would find that it weakens your case further. I can’t find the transcript, but I bet she confirms that Obama did not support the surge, and that her point is that Obama believes the surge did not deliver the promised results. Have you seen the video or transcript of the entire conversation?

There may be some damning evidence out there that shows Obama is lying about having supported the surge, but you haven’t shown it yet. Until you do, I must maintain that your accusation is shameful.