13 Comments

• 1. Dave Rottonburg  |  July 8th, 2008 at 7:18 am

  The Prime Minister of Iraq wants US forces to leave, as does the Iraqi Parliament. The government refuse to enter into a bilateral agreement with the US unless there is a timetable for US withdraw of all troops.

  Does that make the Iraqi government cut-and-runners?

• 2. Cooldown  |  July 8th, 2008 at 7:46 am

  Images of Nixon’s Saigon debacle must really haunt the Repugs. The Victory in Iraq spin is so thick you can cut it with a knife. By the time the UN resolution permitting the U.S. to occupy Iraq ends December 31st the neocons will have us believe they handed over a little piece of paradise for Iraqi self rule.

  Anyway back to reality, come January 21st the real war on terror will be re-engaged in forgotten Afghanistan.

• 3. bongoman  |  July 8th, 2008 at 8:24 am

  So what about the Status of Forces Agreement?

  We gonna get our permanent bases or not?

  What’s more important - Iraqi sovereignty or our control of the region?

• 4. Fredrick Schwartz  |  July 8th, 2008 at 9:24 am

  
  “What we need, now, is to start planning some way of thanking our troops for their sacrifices in this campaign - we can’t gather them all together in one place, but I think we should find some public way to crown their efforts. The traditional means is a ticker tape parade in New York City, and I think that this would be appropriate, especially given that NYC is where the war began - of course, the war isn’t over, but one must pause from time to time to pay tribute to those who having been making the real efforts.”

  You want to do a soldier who has served in Iraq a favor? Hire him, help his family with their mortgage, teach them to save for their retirement through Treasury Bills buy them a deep freezer and a months supply of frozen veggies anything that an everyday person can do. Enough of the political coating of turds in diamond dust pal. Noonan I swear I think you are really a good man but this is beneath you and sounds at best lame and effete and at worse an insult to every man and woman who served in Iraq.

  I threw up when I read that. Had to pull the waste can up to the edge of my desk and gave up breakfast. One you must have never seen combat because if you had you wouldn’t be so flippant about parades. Even generals that have won wars hate parades; they’d rather see their soldiers treated better than the neocons have treated those with traumatic brain injuries seeking help from the VA. As long as you’re deployable everything is fine once that’s over you’re a husk. Been that was since Valley Forge and it will be that way as long as there is an American solider in uniform.

  And no war began in NYC. Please Noonan for the love of gefilte fish why do you insist on droning abut 9/11. It was a balls out attack on an American symbol of power meant to strike fear into the hearts and minds of people like you and it worked. Every time you invoke the weepy sadness of 9/11 as some sort of spiritual touchstone you let al Qaeda have another free chip at the card table. And every time you link Iraq to the al Qaeda attacks you make yourself look like a bought and paid for fool of the Bush administration. The ‘war on terror’ is nothing more than a political marketing tool that will be cast of finally after the end of the first McCain term or first two years of Obama’s first term. First off the US cannot afford the war on terror. Every day the Department of Homeland Security gobbles up money that could have been spent in the clear on CIA or FBI operations abroad. Now those ops are in the 40 or so MMM black budget that rotates around various committees in Congress.

  I know this will sound more unpatriotic than analytical to you but it will take another terror attack in the US to make 9/11 meaningless and allow this sham to be put to bed. Once Americans take the attitude Israelis have had for 30 years, that people blowing themselves up is a shame but not a reason to act against one’s own self interest, the neocons will have to find some other way to hijack the American government. This one didn’t work and the next attack whether it is based in North Waziristan with al Qaeda or domestically with some racist groups post Obama’s election will close the doors and windows on your conservative cage and shelter you in place—permanently.

• 5. Magnum Serpentine  |  July 8th, 2008 at 10:34 am

  Gains? What Gains? All I see is the disastrous george war continuing on and on and on.

  “You can’t do it my friend,” McCain 2008

  “Yes We can,” Obama 2008

• 6. majoriot  |  July 8th, 2008 at 10:41 am

  Whoa nelly!
  Still trying to connect Iraq with 9-11!

  And another thing. How is it when Bush, after 4+ years of failure, “refines” his policy, strategy, tactics and you fall all over it like a dog rubbing on a dead animal.
  Then Obama mentions “refining” his policy and there is a problem.

  Ahem…buddy, your hypocrisy is showing.

• 7. dedosinuna  |  July 8th, 2008 at 12:28 pm

  one of your more vomitous posts, Mark.

  First you declare once again that the US has won an irreversible victory in Iraq, and then you go on to ruminate about what kind of public ceremony (read: “Right Wing political pageant”) would be the most appropriate way to “thank” the troops.

  uh, here’s an idea: since you say we’ve “won” this needless and wasteful war, then why don’t we “thank” the troops by getting them out of there?

  What our soldiers really need is to not continue fighting and dying for nothing in a Fool’s war. Besides our respect, among other things, it appears our soldiers could also use better health care, including access to mental health care, assistance with bills, and help going to school. What they don’t need is to be used as props in more shamelessly self-promoting Republican exercises in flag-waving.

  Sorry, the US military is not your partisan propaganda tool.

  And please - it is foolish and cynical in the extreme to say that the Iraq war started in NY, because Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. Even your bumbling hero Mr Bush long ago admitted that fact.

• 8. OhioOrrin  |  July 8th, 2008 at 1:28 pm

  bongoman - we have massive infrastructure in Quatar already.

  I did NOT say to unass Iraq entirely.

• 9. Kahn  |  July 8th, 2008 at 5:08 pm

  Bringing up Iraq is like poking a stick at you rabid liberals. It doesn’t matter what the situation on the ground is. It doesn’t matter what the political situation there is. Your answer was don’t go in. Don’t stay. Don’t add forces. Don’t stay.

  We get it. But since that is your answer to EVERYTHING - excuse us if we discount your council.

  Now - to the non-foaming at the mouth crowd:

  1. We are there.

  2. The surge, and actually the leadership of General Petraeus has made a huge difference. Al-Queda is for the most part defeated. Sunni’s are making deals with us. Shiites are helping us hunt down their more radical whackos. And the end picture is beginning to take shape.

  3. EVERYONE, including us conservatives want this to end.

  4. However, AFTER it ends, having some presence in a post-war Iraq would be good. Iraq borders Iran, Turkey, Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and the Gulf. It is a good place to have say, a division and a nice air base.

  5. So the Iraqis think it’s time to start planning the withdrawal of some of our forces. Good. Lets do it.

  6. The Kurds are a wild card. Persecuted by Sadaam. Largely autonomous NOW. They have been the major conduit for weapons into the country. And, they have designs on southern Turkey ( a NATO member) and northern Iran.

  7. Iran is foaming at the mouth anti-Israel and anti-America….. in public. Actually many people think this is a diversion and their real goal is to seize the southern oil fields from Iraq. Are they working on nukes or not? Who can say? You trust them?

• 10. Pain  |  July 8th, 2008 at 6:24 pm

  9. Kahn | July 8th, 2008 at 5:08 pm

  1. And the reason why changes with each new leak.

  2. the increase in troops concentrated in baghdad has decreased the sectarian violence; paying several hundreds of millions of dollars to your former enemies in al Anbar has done more, however.

  3. We, Ourselves agree.

  4. Qatar or Kuwait would be better.

  5. Actually, al Maliki wants a timetable for full withdrawal.

  6. Well at some point America will have to choose between kurdistan and turkiye and consiodering the oil in in Kurdistan We think the turks will get the works!

  7. We think the threats to Israel from Iran are quite real but what is greater is their fear of a rogue America. A rational diplomat would ralize that a nuclear Iran would become a mutually assured destruction deterrant to both nations as it was beterrn the US and the USSR. Or We could be wrong and Iran could nuke the shit out of the whole region for absolutely nothing because they are really an unknown quantity. Still We do not understand why they cannot have weapons that they build themselves merely because it threatens a nation with a wealthy ethnic minority in USA?

• 11. Kahn  |  July 8th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

  1. Yah sure, whatever.

  2. Well that works, right? I hear that a good percentage of the Sunni’s would like to join the post war army.

  4. You can’t drive to Iran from Qatar or Kuwait without going through Iraq. But please… why would it be “better”?

  5. Right. Its accepted that this statement was for domestic consumption and that we are negotiating for bases. You ever take a class in negotiating? Ever hear about the concept of starting high if you’re the seller?

  6. You think so eh? Better see if you can find a map of Turkey that includes oil and gas pipelines.

  7. It was only after the absolute slaughters on Peleliu, Tarawa, Saipan, Iwo Jima, and Okinawa that we decided to use two comparatively small and crude nuclear devices. Let’s just take Iran at it’s word… they say they will destroy Israel and hurt us. If you don’t care about the deaths of millions of people because they are Jews. OK. That’s your position. Thanks for contributing, let me know how the next Hollywood fundraiser goes.

  AGAIN, we understand the lefts “withdraw now no matter what” position. Got it.

• 12. Pain  |  July 9th, 2008 at 7:57 am

  52. FmrMarine | July 8th, 2008 at 4:47 pm

  Have you no titles?

  Are you not the “father of children” or “worker of metals.” We, Ourselves are aware that there is no Peerage in America but of course people do separate themselves by a variety of secular and spiritual titles all the time. Our ability to function on many levels allows Us to perform tasks as diverse as Fifth Sea Lord and preside over matters at civil law as the Ayatollah of Rham & Its Shadow.

  Did you not accept help from many countries in driving Saddam Hussein from Kuwait when he invaded that nation illegally? Then it is Our Mandate that We show you the proper way by explaining your errors in invading Iraq and in many other areas. The mark of a truly sentient race is learning from mistakes and since these mistakes that have been made in the last eight years are grave and must never be repeated it is Our duty to make as many pronouncements as possible and do all We can within the boundaries of Hellac Law to guide Terra back toward her destiny.

  2. js | July 9th, 2008 at 7:20 am

  It is an easily corrected thing js just start following your Bible and stoning Christian girls who get abortions in public and in ninety days the problem will solve itself by either most of the fundies being in prison [guests of state governments for murder in an ironic twist that sort of tastes to Us like unagi flavored gumdrops] of teenage girls being too terrified to go to Planned Parenthood.

  Is this not the sort of Old Testament unusual punishment that you seek that you wish to kill women who decry with their own bodies they are free by not being bound to breed when a man chooses? Can you even debate this topic rationally? We, Ourselves do not think so.

  11. Kahn | July 8th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

  1. And yes you are caught here in the conundrum of WMD, to get Saddam, to liberate to Iraqi people, to pkant democracy in the Middle East. Yes indeed Kahn whatever, yes indeed. When your own Dick Cheney said it would be a disaster to go into Baghdad in the first Gulf War yes Kahn, whatever is easy for you to say.

  2. Yes and after £ 4MMM have been spent what do you expect to happen when those payments stop? Who’s side will those Sunnis in al Anbar be on then? Bashir Assad’s?

  4. No basing the US force in Kuwait or Qatar would be better than permanent bases in Iraq.

  5. This statement seemed to be directed at the negotiators themselves rather than something Prime Minister al Maliki said to Al Bawaba, it was prepared, in English and sent to the press Association and the AP by fax. How again is that for Iraqi internal political consumption?

  6. The kurds would make far more money going through Iraq with their pipeline and linking up in Basra to refineries in Saudi Arabia. Who refines oil near the bosporus? Bulgaria?

  7. We do care about Israel as a viable state but We also care about the rights of all nations to pursue their own defense courses. There is much technical skill among engineers in Iran and their space program in the next decade will be the star of the Middle East. But this aside is there no means that there can be peace between all of these nations? Ahmadinejad is nothing more to the Iranians than Jeremiah is to the Vatican. The real power lays with Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and negotiations with the next administration at a level below that [State with Iranian Foreign Ministry] will be crucial to an eventual Middle east peace summit to solve the problem of Jerusalem in a manner that all parties can accept.

  And do not make the horrible error of trying to paint Us as an anti-Semite, please no such thought should ever enter your head. We feel more strongly for Israel than you could ever hope to understand. this is not about politics or a petty squabble this is about the continuation of life on Terra. Look at you Kahn at how flippant you have become merely 6 plus Terran years from a day when you gasped in disbelief at how easy it is to be killed. You say that is the day that changed everything but yet you learned only a greater arrogance from the event. But do not concern yourself habibi! We all know Us followers of the truth us Shi’a We all know that America can give a lesson surely with her great might but also it is graphically clear that she can take a lesson as well.

  May Peace cover all. Inshallah!

• 13. TampaBayRayz-4-evah-don't-mess  |  July 9th, 2008 at 8:13 am

  Kahn: I’m Jewish and I assure you Jewish people and the state of Israel have no greater friend in the blog world than PAIN. She is expressing the views the majority of Israelis hold. Before Bush invaded Iraq, Iran, Lebanon, Lybia, Saudi Arabia and Syria were sitting on ready to take the same deal with Israel that Egypt had.

  Furthermore, I’d like to ask you if you see Iran as a great threat to Israel, and if you get your way and McCain is elected and is poised to launch an all-out attack on Iran, how does he propose to protect the 100,000 Persian Jews in Teheran? No proposal, eh. Just collateral damage. Very, very nice.