What is Your Greatest Moral Failure?
August 18th, 2008 at 09:03am Mark Noonan
That was one of the questions at Saddleback, and McCain just flat out answered it - the way he failed in his first marriage. How many of us, I wonder, have the courage to go on television and give that clear a statement? Its on my mind a bit now - of course, the first thing I have to do is go through that mental Rolodex O’ Errors and try to sift down decades of sin into something which is clearly a great moral failure. In the context McCain used, it would have to be something I did which I knew in advance was the wrong thing to do, and yet I went right on and did it, anyways; or something that you know you should of done, but you slunk away from it like a coward. Its one thing to acknowledge in public one is a sinner (heck, from time to time we Catholics even do that in Church - “I confess to you, Almighty God and you, my brothers and sisters, that I have sinned…”), but there is a gulf between a generalised statement of error and a specific acceptance of responsibility for failure.
Among my errors, I have these two things which weigh upon my mind:
1. Back when I was in the Navy, I stumbled across an attempted racial discrimination against a shipmate, and did nothing about it. Just happened to go into the room just as two very senior white enlisted men were in the process of attempting to screw out of a plumb assignment a black shipmate in favor of a white shipmate. I can take the excuse of youth, but that really doesn’t cut it - I should have done something specific about it, but I didn’t. The screwing failed, probably on account of my interruption of it, but that doesn’t lessen my failure an iota.
2. For very many years, I refused to forgive members of my family for their many failings, as if I were perfect and not in need of forgiveness, too.
As noted, there are many other errors - but my sins of commission pale in comparison, at least in many cases, with my sins of omission. You wish you could go back in time and do it right - but, you can’t; while your sins can be forgiven, they can’t be unmade. Always better to strive to get it right from the start, and forgive those around you who fail, because if you didn’t fail today, then its really more a matter of God’s grace rather than any perfection on your part.
Entry Filed under: Campaign 2008, Religion, Republicans
37 Comments
1. What is Your Greatest Mor&hellip | August 18th, 2008 at 9:48 am
[...] Original post by Mark Noonan [...]
2. gotbrains? | August 18th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
Noonan -
“…McCain just flat out answered it.”
Well, yes, he flat out answered because there is ample evidence now that Mr McCain got the questions about 30 minutes before they were asked of him.
But beyond that, I am a little curious as to why you laud McCain’s answer as showing courage and candor, when Mr McCain was not forthcoming about his extra-marital affairs at the time he was running for congress. I mean, it’s pretty easy to issue a “mea culpa” 30 years after the fact, and long after his affairs had come to public light. If John Edwards were to say the same thing 30 years from now, would you be praising him in this way?
Secondly, I found Mr McCain’s answer to this question to be rather lacking in any kind of detail. He made it sound like it he merely regretted an average, run-of-the-mill divorce. Most people hearing this would just say to themselves, “well, if getting a divorce is McCain’s highest moral failing, then he must be pretty moral - after all, lots of people get a divorce.” Heck, most marriages today end in divorce, so most people would totally relate.
What’s missing in this story is that the divorce part is not really an issue. The issue is that Mr McCain cheated on his wife, a woman who had faithfully waited for him for 6 years while he was imprisoned, during which time she had to raise his children on her own. Mrs McCain had a terrible accident during this time that left her somewhat crippled and quite overweight. So 42 year old John McCain started fooling around with other women, including a 24 year old named Cindy Hensley.
The Righties are merely trying to pass this thing off by saying “so McCain got divorced 30 years ago - big deal!” McCain’s own answer at Saddleback plays into this attempt to gloss things over. But the fact that his marriage failed is not the salient part of this sorry affair. The issue here is that it is rather unseemly for a 42 year old man to cheat on his crippled wife with a 24 year old girl. And the more encompassing issue is that the Right is usually screaming to high heaven in condemnation about such moral lapses - unless of course it involves one of their own.
That 24 year old girl who old man John McCain was fooling around with eventually became the current Cindy McCain. If John McCain wins the White House, what shall we call Cindy? The First “Lady”? Or maybe the First “Other Woman”?
3. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 12:39 pm
Here is a news story that should help Obambi figure out that pay grade question.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1218710394816&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
A premature baby who was pronounced dead “came back to life” Sunday after five hours in Nahariya Hospital.
The baby girl, who was in a cooler at the hospital, suddenly showed signs of life and was being treated in the premature baby unit.
Doctors estimated that the cooler brought the fetus “back to life.”
The mother, 26, from a Western Galilee village, was in the fifth month of her pregnancy when she underwent a series of tests, during which it was discovered that she was suffering from internal bleeding and that the embryo had ceased to show signs of life.
The woman underwent an abortion and the baby, weighing 610 grams, was extracted from her womb without a pulse, hospital officials said.
A senior doctor pronounced the baby dead and she was transferred to the cooler.
Five hours later, the woman’s husband came to the hospital to take what he thought was his dead baby girl for burial.
When the baby was taken out of the cooler, she began to breathe. The premature baby was then taken to the intensive care ward, where doctors were attempting to save her
4. gotbrains? | August 18th, 2008 at 12:42 pm
And I hasten to add that Mr McCain would not be the first president to have had a divorce. Ronald Reagan too had been divorced, and it wasn’t an issue. But then again, Mr Reagan wasn’t screwing around with a young hottie while he was in his first marriage. See the difference?
This isn’t about divorce. It’s about hypocrisy and character.
5. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 12:42 pm
If it were up to Obama, the baby would have simply been put back in the cooler, as it was not alive enough. I think this has just become a major issue, and the Dems “softer” approach to abortion isn’t going to cut it on babies delivered alive being alowed to die.
6. gotbrains? | August 18th, 2008 at 12:47 pm
Rich - I believe this post was about McCain’s answer to the question of greatest moral failing - not the question about when a human life begins.
7. Sunny | August 18th, 2008 at 1:01 pm
Rich, do you think you can stay on topic? It isn’t about abortion, it is about our greatest moral failures. You are just assuming that Barack Obama that the baby would have been put back into the cooler. I believe that you are completly wrong in your assesment.
We are all human and make mistakes - somethime big mistakes. By God’s grace we are forgiven. None of us are without sin and none have been delegated by God to judge others. The only perfect man to walk this earth was hung on a cross and dies for your sins and mine.
I thought both candidates did a very good job in answering all of the questions from Pastor Warren. I especially appreciated the tone of the conversations and Pastor Warren’s stand that it is time for civil conversation and ending the politics as usual mud slinging. there are too many very important issues to get lost in personal attacks.
8. jayhay | August 18th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
I have to say Mark, it is a real testament to your ability to forgive in light of “members of [your] family for their many failings”.
I’m willing to forgive you as well for your many failings.
9. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 1:09 pm
Gotbrains- Seriously, I’m sure we never heard one peep from you about Monica lewinsky. More recently, we never heard anything from you about the mayors of San Francisco, Detroit or Los Angelos. Now you are trying to use the Edwards scandal (cheating on a cancer stricken wife, fathering a child while cheating, lying repeatedly about, and using campaign finances to cover it up all while running for the office of the presidency) to bludgeon McCain for something twenty plus years ago (and which he has admitted to publicly by the way). To top it all off you are calling McCain a hypocrite when he has not even weighed in on the issue. Pray tell, what has McCain been hypocrital about on this topic? P.S. A female that is twenty four years old is a woman not a girl, and how old was Bill Clinton and how old was Monica by the way? Like most lefties on the topics of morality, you have no authority on this issue. It is above your pay grade.
10. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
The topic is about the saddleback debate and moral failings, the topic of abortion and Obama’s stance of allowing born babies to die is very on topic as it is a huge moral failing. Interesting that you don’t want to debate it.
Sunny, please tell me you don’t agree with Barak that a baby born alive, even if during an abortion, should be allowed to die without any type of treatment?
11. gotbrains? | August 18th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Rich -
“If it were up to Obama, the baby would have simply been put back in the cooler…”
This kind of hyperbole is so typical of you wingnuts. Obama answers that he does not know exactly when a baby get human rights. This is a deeper spiritual question that has vexed people for hundreds of years. Does an embryo of a few cells the size of a pinhead have the same human rights as a new born baby? And if not, then when exactly in the gestation process does that occur? Barack, recognizing that he is not Lord of the Universe with some special devine knowledge, said that he does not know the answer to this question. Talk about candor - jeez, when was the last time you ever heard a politician say he doesn’t know something?
From this answer, you then wildly jump to “Obama would put a live baby back into a refrigerator”. That’s a very stupid thing to say, but unfortunately is very typical of the kind of raw emotionalism and distortions that drive movement conservatism.
If a fetus has died in the womb, extracting that dead body is often necessary to save the life of the mother. Your story misinforms on two levels:
1) the overwhelming majority of abortions occur in the first tri-mester, when the zygote is a blastula about the size of a lima bean. You can argue as to whether this constitutes a human being with full rights or not. But your story propagates the misinformed idea that abortions regularly involve killing a nearly full term baby. Hence your ridiculous and dispicable hyperbole that Obama would favor putting the baby back into the refrigerator. You are basically making the hysterical charge that anybody who supports a woman’s right to choose loves to kill live born babies, and possibly eats them for breakfast.
2) your story is about a baby that miraculously survived, and as such is an extreme exception. That might happen one in a million times. Given that a dead fetus then becomes a serious, life-threatening condition for the mother, should a dead fetus just be left to rot inside her on the one in a million possibility that the doctors had somehow been mistaken that the fetus was actually dead? You make it sound like most babies who were mistakenly declared dead by doctors would actually revive upon delivery. That is ridiculously misleading.
12. gotbrains? | August 18th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
Rich, Rich, Rich -
post 10: …”please tell me you don’t agree with Barak that a baby born alive, even if during an abortion, should be allowed to die without any type of treatment?”
Barack Obama said that? Really? Please, give me the full quote where Obama says that he advocates leaving a “baby born alive to die without any type of treatment.”
Of course, he never remotely said any such thing. As usual, you are engaging in baseless, distorted smears.
13. Ryan | August 18th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Allright, smartass. WHAt evidence do you have, actual evidence, that there was any ‘pre leaking’ of the questions, other than a conspiracy rant by lefties who can’t believe that the Godlike Obama coudl actually look second besat at anything?
14. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 1:41 pm
Gotbrains- Obama voted no on the BORN Alive ACT. This means that he is against living breathing babies, not zygotes,not eggs, not sperm, buty living breathing babies getting medical care outside of the womb in the case of failed abortions. Talk about hyperbole. Did I mention anything about embryo’s or zygotes? Please point that out to me? I would actually be for embryonic stem cell research if it could be shown to work, so you are barking up the wrong tree here buddy. We are talking about babies outside the womb, you know it and I know it.
“If a fetus has died in the womb, extracting that dead body is often necessary to save the life of the mother. ”
No shit Sherlock. Where did I write anything about having a problem with dead babies being induced? The rub is the fact that live babies are allowed to die outside the womb, and Obama voted as such to protect abortions as a whole.
“But your story propagates the misinformed idea that abortions regularly involve killing a nearly full term baby.”
The story does no such thing. It mentions this case and this case alone. Stop lieing. Again you talk of hyperbole and yet you go on to make up five or six lies about a very simple and short news article.
“You are basically making the hysterical charge that anybody who supports a woman’s right to choose loves to kill live born babies, and possibly eats them for breakfast.”
Please point to my writing above that supports this charge.
Finally,
“Given that a dead fetus then becomes a serious, life-threatening condition for the mother, should a dead fetus just be left to rot inside her on the one in a million possibility that the doctors had somehow been mistaken that the fetus was actually dead?”
I don’t know if your reading comprehension is really this bad, if you didn;t actually read the article, or if you are just being ignorant on purpose. The story and the issue is not about dead babies inside the womb, not about the morality of abortion, not about choice, it is about a premature baby that was still alive following an abortion. This happens sometimes. What happens to these live babies outside of the womb is important, and Obama has voted against giving them rights as human beings. Not zygotes, not embryos, not eggs, breathing babies. Seriously wipe the froth off of your mouth and read the half page article again. In it you will find none of your assertions you have written above.
15. Ryan | August 18th, 2008 at 1:48 pm
So it turns out that Pastor Rick Warren, in an effort to increase the candidates’ comfort level with his pioneering format, gave each of them a heads-up on several of the hardest questions he asked Saturday night during his “the Saddleback Civil Forum on the presidency.”
A source close to Warren tells Playbook that the candidates knew in advance they would be asked their own greatest moral failure, America’s greatest moral failure, and the three wisest people in their lives.
16. LiberalMind | August 18th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
My greatest moral failure was my complacency as the radical right wing poisoned American politics and brought great harm to this nation.
While these gang of criminals pillaged the commons in broad daylight, I did very little to stop the carnage.
When the Bush crime syndicate stole the Florida election and hence the presidency, I did very little to oppose this outrage.
I will never stand idly by as this nation suffers.
17. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
For an article describing Obama’s actual votes on these issues, go here-
http://www.nysun.com/national/obama-facing-attacks-from-all-sides-over-abortion/84059/
Moral failings indeed. He compounds his mistakes by lieing about his voting record on this issue.
18. Ryan | August 18th, 2008 at 2:03 pm
SO the one that trie to uphold the actual election results was stealing, where the one that tried to CHANGE the lection results from where they actually were, was being honorable. Bizzare.
19. Rich | August 18th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
LiberalMind, good for you. Your next step is to get a plane ticket to Lahore, travel by foot to Afghanistan, and take up arms against your evil overlords. Or you could take another hit from the bong. Your choice, but you will be more successful with the latter.
20. Pain | August 18th, 2008 at 2:45 pm
Ameen.
21. CanadianObserver | August 18th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
16. LiberalMind | August 18th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
My greatest moral failure was my complacency as the radical right wing poisoned American politics and brought great harm to this nation.
————————————
You were not alone in this moral failure, LiberalMind. Countless Americans shared this failure with you.
Many, like you, have now come to realize how much damage their complacency has done to their country and are showing genuine remorse.
There are others like Rich, however, who still need to own up to this particular moral failure.
22. Danish Artist | August 18th, 2008 at 3:21 pm
Obama’s greatest moral failure….
Obama opposed legislation in Illinois that would declare babies, who survived an induced labor abortion, “a viable human life”.
On, the Born Alive Act, he voted “PRESENT” on one vote (talk about gutless!). Then he voted NO. Then he LIED as to why he voted NO.
But don’t take my word for it, let his record speak for itself. We deal in FACTS and not liberal fantasy concerning their messiah. Pay attention, your “messiah’s” radical record is making the light of day and Obama campaign based on image is slowly imploding.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPZCXcTwZPY
23. js | August 18th, 2008 at 3:21 pm
the mccain divorce is a distraction
the real story is why obama continued to work deals with rezko after he knew rezko was under indictment for wheeling and dealing in government contracts…the ethic’s bordering divorce are a real non story, after the democrats hid all the clinton deeds to get him elected….what is a story is why we never get the whole truth about obamas past…
just like clinton….the dnc is hiding the truth…because they know that if the whole truth about obama were exposed….they dont stand a chance in november…
and you think clinton was a huge mistake?
“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6djWY9GNRU0″
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=56626
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88V3F6_iUus
24. Upstart | August 18th, 2008 at 3:46 pm
For all those standing behind the bravery of McCain confessing his poking for cash 30 years later, below are the now famous words of Sean Hanninty earlier this month describing trust in an individual committing McCain type adultery.
HANNITY: I’m not getting this. Explain to me and I’m wondering if you can’t keep the promise to your family, can’t keep your promise to your wife, you’re having an affair, you’re lying about the affair repeatedly, why should the American people trust you when you say you’re not going to lie to them? Why should we trust you?
But we all know Hannity was only talking about Democrats; yeah right.
25. js | August 18th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
really…america should know if obama really is homosexual…that has far more reaching impact than a divorce…
26. Carl Gordon | August 18th, 2008 at 6:29 pm
The local disputation is that it was me that, in fact, was the unaccredited author that inscribed a seditious report damning any and all Repug conspirators of whom I have battled and suffered the wounds of their simpleton degradations. And it is entirely plausible, based on the dossier I have compiled in tribute to the struggle of the loyal opposition, that some of you might be of a kindred spirit, yea, someone to thoroughly address the broader tenet of our existence against which we all grapple in some vainglorious endeavor towards some acme of recompense. Your infrequent but hotly received lexis are (is?) a driving force, a flaming rapier that inspires me onward, a beacon of distinction to guide all contrary souls that may provisionally dwell in some begotten crypt of despondency, to not capitulate against the dying of the light, even if it’s just the hall light on the way to the bathroom. But I digress. How are you really? What is the state of all that is uncurious and and in collusion in this befuddled drama without connotation nor purposeful thrust?
I could go on but I might cut into something more important, like monthly toad hunting or dancing with a local sandwich, so I’ll leave you to it. I suppose at this juncture you, like a lot of people that read my diatribes, are probably yearning for a little stopping power, be it from mystical silent sky-bound and bearded old dudes, or the business end of 38 special pointed intently at the speech center, just left of my right arched eyebrow, so I’ll save you the trouble. Write me often and with real or imagined intent, whilst I search for holes in Merton’s theory, hoping for salvation.
27. Xavier Cugat | August 18th, 2008 at 6:33 pm
Title of the thread: What is Your Greatest Moral Failure?
Noonan wanted people to cite their great failure, and he led the way with his heart-wrenching confession.
It’s now turned into a raging debate on Obama’s greatest moral failing.
That’s soooo typical. You would think John 8:7 was written this way instead:
28. 42 | August 18th, 2008 at 6:44 pm
“McCain just flat out answered it - the way he failed in his first marriage”
Wrong Noonan, he said “the failure of my first marriage” He took no personal responsibility and and shows no regret for the infidelity…and that’s an answer you respect? explains a lot about you Noonan
29. Sam Balton | August 18th, 2008 at 9:44 pm
My greatest moral failure was voting for Ron Reagan. I knew he was a coward and backstabber when he named names during the McCarthy hearings, but still I gave him a pass because I he seemed stronger that Carter.
Little did I know then that he promised Iran he would sell them weapons if they held the hostages until after the 1980 election. The man was a traitor.
30. Rana Quijotesca | August 18th, 2008 at 10:00 pm
Ryan… Obama didn’t vote against the “Born-Alive Infants Protections Act”… it was passed by Unanimous Consent in the Senate… Fact-Check Fail…
My Greatest Moral Failure…
I don’t really have too many of those… but I guess that it would involve lying for expediency at some point… I tend to fly on the straight and narrow usually…
31. dickvee | August 18th, 2008 at 10:13 pm
Hey 42…his first wife is John’s biggest fan. Sort of aggravates your position that only one party was harmed. After all this whining about cheating, McCain needs to quickly call for another meeting. Either in the same format, or as a townhall debate. The lefties messiah will wilt and hide his agenda in flowery prose, while McCain will be strong and on point. The lefties are on the run…Go John…slay the commies!!
32. Mark Noonan | August 18th, 2008 at 11:19 pm
Xavier,
I guess I was expecting something different from what we got - but as confession is good for the soul, it is also difficult to do.
33. Candy O'Doole | August 18th, 2008 at 11:28 pm
Deleted - foolish.
34. Leo Pusateri | August 18th, 2008 at 11:43 pm
And your proof of this is…
My biggest moral failure was when I was 15 years old…
I went to the arcade with my friends. The lady at the cash register had her child behind the counter… he looked like he may have been five or six or so… he looked pale and sickly, and very, very thin. I should have asked her what was wrong, but I didn’t.
As I look back now, I believe that the child may have been suffering from neglect, and it bugs me even unto this day…
If I could only go back 33 years…
35. Jeremiah | August 19th, 2008 at 12:38 am
My greatest moral failure … Well, I don’t know if you can call it “moral” or not, but one of them I guess is not going on to trade school.
And now to the biggy…
Perhaps my greatest of all moral failures, and yes, I must confess…
I haven’t been going to church like I should, because I’m shy and don’t like to be around a lot of people. I read my Bible and like to tell individual persons about the Lord…but I just can’t seem to get the courage to go to church. I used not be like this, and I don’t understand it.
I have struggled and struggled. Please say a prayer for me, that God would help me to work this out, and give me the courage to start going to church again.
:(
36. Kurt | August 19th, 2008 at 1:41 am
Does rooting for Jimmy Carter to win the 1976 election when I was 10 years old count as a moral faiure? If so, I am really ashamed of that.
On McCain’s divorce, if this 30 year old issue is a problem for people, is Obama’s self admitted cocaine use not even 25 years ago a problem for his supporters?
Carol McCain has made it very clear that her and John McCain are still friends and she fully supports him for President. As Carol McCain said just this year,
“He’s a good guy. We are still good friends. He is the best man for president.” Enough said.
37. Lucas | August 19th, 2008 at 2:00 am
This is definitely a tough one for me, because the one that sticks out the most happened just recently…
As soon as I turned 21 I decided I wanted to find out what drinking was like… Oh what a ride I was in for. Like most people who have ever tried it, I was hooked, I loved it. I had a drinking buddy from work and when Thursday night (the big night at the local tavern) came, that’s what was on my mind. For about six months it’s all that was on my mind.
Well, one day I decided to stop by the local drug store and pick me up a fifth of Wild Turkey, my then favorite drink. I stowed it away and took a few sips for a couple nights. But then one night I lost control of myself, and took the almost full bottle and didn’t stop drinking. Before I knew it, I lost consciousness … Jeremiah can recall this account, he was here during that time.
Next thing I knew, I woke up in the hospital with a busted nose and lip, lots and lots happened that night. I took a vow after that, to my family and most importantly my brother that I wasn’t gonna drink anymore. My selfish act was hurting everyone.
Well, two weeks later I wound up back down at the tavern. It wasn’t until I stumbled in and passed out in my bed, and went through the worst headache I’ve ever had, that what I had just done dawned on me… I lied, I broke a promise, to the most important people in the world to me. I was upset that day, I tried to shake it off and justify myself, but I couldn’t. The only way I knew to make it right was to make that the final straw, and move on. After lots of apologizing I realized the only way to move on, was just that, move on.
There’s no reason to look back at those mistakes and think what if, but it’s better to look back and say ‘yeah, I know better now.’