The title of this entry shamelessly stolen from Mark Steyn over at NRO’s The Corner – but its just too appropriate:
Gordon Brown should mark the 60th anniversary of the NHS this year by turning its birthday on July 5 into an extra annual bank holiday, a leading Labour thinktank will urge today.
The Fabian Society will say the prime minister has long dreamed of establishing a “British day” to celebrate nationhood. The most appropriate date would be on the anniversary of the health service – an institution which appeals equally to people in England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
An essay by Rachael Jolley and Sunder Katwala, the society’s general secretary, points out that England and Wales have eight public holidays, compared with at least 10 in most EU countries. Scotland has nine and Northern Ireland 10.
In 2006, before Brown became prime minister, he told a Fabian conference: “What is the British equivalent of the US fourth of July, or even the French 14th of July? … What is our equivalent for a national celebration of who we are and what we stand for?” He said he had in mind giving the country a new public holiday.
There’s just something extraordinarily Euro-socialist in that – another paid day off, and to celebrate dependency upon a bloated, ineffecient government bureaucracy. It’d be like having AFDC Day here in the United States. One wonders – is what the Brits stand for really socialised health care? Long waiting lists, poor quality of care, routinely going over budget? Thus another page is written in the very final chapter of the Story of Britain.
Blogs For Victory 
You mean the citizens of the UK are so pleased with the single-payer health care they receive that they decided to have a holiday over it?
50% of all bankruptcies in the US last year were due to medical bills. The Brits, and Europeans in large, must feel a great sense of pride knowing that their governments consider the health of its population a basic human right as well as a national security issue that cannot not be trusted in the paws of profiteers. They must also feel relief knowing that illness will not bring their families to financial ruin.
If only the US politicians would break the chains to corporate donors and do what is right for its citizens, like every other Western nation.
Even if what you say about waiting lists and poor quality of care is true, it still beats having no health care. In fact, I know lots of folks who use the NHS in Britain and the quality of care seems to be just fine. Waiting lists are for non-essential treatments only. Private insurance and private physicians are available as well for those who would like to pay for a higher level of service, just like the States.
Don’t knock it til you try it.
Yes, I’m rather with CW on that one.
The purpose of the htealth insurance, from the point of view of the client, is to give back money when and where it is needed to save a life.
That moment is the moment where said client is at his/her most defenceless.
From the point of view of the compagny shareholders, of course, the purpose of the compagny is to make money. Every dollar given is a dollar lost. So the temptation not to pay is great, and the bad repercussions (litigation, loss of patronage) of cheating are quite minor. Litigation is costly, and few people who struggle to pay their medical bills can afford it. As for loss of patronage, no-one else in the business is going to take the leaving client, who now has a preexisting condition.
So it stands to reason that the organisation giving the money back should not be in it for profit.
Or, at least, it is obvious to us over here (you know, those in the country with the best overall health system in the world).
This is why we gave control of our “sécurité sociale” to the government, who is not in it for money, and whose leaders can be held accountable at the voting booth.
And for all the government’s inefficiencies, we pay half, per capita, for our health, what you do ( http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0934556.html ).
Plus, national health coverage does not preclude private health coverage, in addition to the national one, for those who want it and can afford it.
Such coverage includes nonessential “health luxuries”, such as the lasik operation, which are not covered by the national system.
So yeah, sometmes it is good to celebrate health care. Do I think it is worth a national holyday? No. But I am kinda tired of people like Mark denigrating every other civilized cournty’s health coverage systemm when yours so obviously sucks. (just one pair of indicators : your life expectancy is
lower than ours, your infant mortality higher : http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004393.html )
No matter, since all that is needed to pass the moderation screen is to change the e-mail, here is my former post :
Yes, I’m rather with CW on that one.
The purpose of the htealth insurance, from the point of view of the client, is to give back money when and where it is needed to save a life.
That moment is the moment where said client is at his/her most defenceless.
From the point of view of the compagny shareholders, of course, the purpose of the compagny is to make money. Every dollar given is a dollar lost. So the temptation not to pay is great, and the bad repercussions (litigation, loss of patronage) of cheating are quite minor. Litigation is costly, and few people who struggle to pay their medical bills can afford it. As for loss of patronage, no-one else in the business is going to take the leaving client, who now has a preexisting condition.
So it stands to reason that the organisation giving the money back should not be in it for profit.
Or, at least, it is obvious to us over here (you know, those in the country with the best overall health system in the world).
This is why we gave control of our “sécurité sociale” to the government, who is not in it for money, and whose leaders can be held accountable at the voting booth.
And for all the government’s inefficiencies, we pay half, per capita, for our health, what you do ( http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0934556.html ).
Plus, national health coverage does not preclude private health coverage, in addition to the national one, for those who want it and can afford it.
Such coverage includes nonessential “health luxuries”, such as the lasik operation, which are not covered by the national system.
So yeah, sometmes it is good to celebrate health care. Do I think it is worth a national holyday? No. But I am kinda tired of people like Mark denigrating every other civilized cournty’s health coverage systemm when yours so obviously sucks. (just one pair of indicators : your life expectancy is
lower than ours, your infant mortality higher : http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004393.html )
For Pete sake CW… 6:33 AM, 20 minutes after this was posted!!! Get a life!
Our leftist trolls have no life but monitoring B4V to ensure that they are the first to post comments on any Post on B4V, in a desperate effort to hijack the threads and control the direction of discourse.
Pathetic.
Too funny Mark – you must be having a ball, pushing the buttons of our local liberals. They’re just way too predictable and you’ve shown it yet again.
Shows how much you know about Britain; although we all complain about the NHS it is the one part of the welfare state that most people agree is a good idea. You always get arguments about benefits etc but most people are glad that the NHS exists. Even Thatcher wouldn’t have got rid of it.
As for a Britishness day, lol they’ll have fun with that one. I don’t call myself British ever, I am Scottish and many Scots feel the same. Even the English are starting to say they are English instead of British. They tried suggesting Churchills birthday but that would not be popular as it is also St Andrews day, which Scots don’t have as holiday and it would be an insult to replace St Andrews day with a Britishness day.
Britain and its constituent nations have a lot to be proud of as does every other nation but a British day is just a way of Brown showing that he’s not, god forbid, really scottish, because at the moment the English don’t like that there is a scottish prime minister becasue we (Scotland) have our own parliament.
Easter Sunday would make a good Federal Holiday.
The English could find a historical event that has much more to do with Independance, like a great military battle, or even King Arthur pulling the sword from the stone, But, To celebrate high taxes or $7.00 a gallon gas is only something an extreme leftist would do.
french student,
In Mark’s defense, apparently their system somehow randomly tags comments for moderation. When mine have been, it seems to be associated with greater length and more links. However, the comments have always come out of moderation when Mark and/or Matt have time from their regular day-to-day to do so. So, I don’t believe you’re being censored here.
For instance, my long post # 53 at The State of the War was in moderation since yesterday afternoon, but my impression is that typically those are seen and brought out of moderation overnight.
Diana,
I thought the same thing, i.e., length and number of links causing problems, because I had a couple of posts hung up in moderation. However, I posted a response to you under the “Al Qaeda Network Nearly Destroyed in 2007” topic regarding Senator Lautenberg’s proposal in the 2008 Defense Bill and it never made it through moderation. It was long and had a fair amount of links, but it still has not showed up. It was not offensive or inflammatory – just long and boring.
Mark (or others opposed to universal health coverage),
Could you please provide some links of what is so terrible in other countries? Aside from the socialism aspect of it, what is actually going on with those systems. And, yes, I’ve seen Sicko, but I hardly doubt there could be a more biased documentary.
Eric um we can’t use an English historical event because that would defeat the purpose of a British day as England is in fact not Britain, it is one of four nations that make up Britain – England, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales.
I can’t see too many Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish being happy to celebrate English history. Much of Britain’s history involves each of the nations that make up Britain fighting and slaughtering each other thus the bttle of Bannockburn celebrates the independence of Scotland but the slaughter of English, the battle of Culloden celebrates the victory of the protestant Scots and English but the destruction of the highland way of life and the massacre of highlanders. I doubt celebrating the Battle of the Boyne would help cement Britishness in Northern Ireland.
Historical events just lead to too much trouble that is why it needs to be something that relates to people across Britain. I personally think a British day is a load of rubbish and would not celebrate it as I don’t consider myself British. Saying that I would take a holiday thogh 🙂
I am British with a sister living in the States who’s husband had a heart attack recently and I know how distressing and frightening the huge medical bills can be in the US if you are not wealthy enough to have medical insurance.
The NHS may have it’s flaws but for important emergencies the care is fantastic. Yes you may have to wait for non urgent treatment, but at least an ingrowing toenail won’t necessitate re-mortgaging your home,
I find talk that the belief in the NHS and the basic right to Health Care as leftist is pretty uninformed and sad.
I would say someone other than CW needs to get a llife!
From the Summer 1990 issue of the journal Health Affairs:
Gallup polled Americans in October of this year on 12 health care reform plans put forward by current presidential candidates and found majority support for all of the plans. What aspects drew the most support? Those related to insurance coverage:
There’s nothing a conservative loves better than to sneer, from a safe distance, at the socialist plans of the other industrialized nations that spend dramatically less per-capita on health care while also consistently shaming the United States in infant mortality. (Hey, don’t worry pro-lifers, at least that baby wasn’t aborted before it died in its first month of life and we’re not actually the worst, Latvia beat us out last year for that distinction.)
So, Mark, why don’t you get the Republican Party to go after the beast right here at home? The United States has a universal taxpayer-funded health care plan right now! Let’s get the GOP platform to include a plank to eliminate Medicare. Here are the benefits:
1) Everyone gets an immediate 2.9% pay raise.
2) The budget will be cut by $386 billion or just over 13%.
3) Budget is balanced.
Sounds like a sure-fire winner for the conservative party. What say you?
Well, as I said. A longer post with some links and it gets hung in “awaiting moderation”.
weefee
My bad, I should have remembered from the time I spoke with you about the Archbishop.
Is the day England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales became Great Britian a holiday?
No it isn’t because they all joined at different times, under different circumstances and at the time it wasn’t popular. The main reason for wanting a British day is the upsurge in nationalism, particularly in Scotland, where the Scottish National Party are in power for the first time and support for independence from Britain is growing. Devolution has challenged the concept of Britain as the English are starting to feel ignored and that Scotland is getting an unfair share of their money and republican Northern Irish have always wanted independence from Britain.
The problem of a national day is that often people are Welsh, Scottish etc first before British or as in my case don’t feel British at all. I think that is why they have chosen something that all Britons believe in. It may seem weird to Americans but for all the flaws in the NHS, we are proud of it and are glad that it is there to serve us. I do however agree that the price of petrol is terrible though, it’s over £1 a litre, perhaps Brown could just reduce the tax on petrol instead of a british day; I’d be happy with that 🙂
Mim,
It is absurd to think there is a right to health care – if you believe that, then you believe you have a right to force some people to take care of you whether they will or no – and if you are forcing someone to work against their will, that is a violation of their rights. A right is something that a human being can at least potentially do on his own – heart surgery doesn’t fit into such a catagory.
Also, emergency care in the United States is first class, and is available to everyone regardless of ability to pay. While you might want to think that the only thing people are waiting for in NHS is ingrown toenail care, the fact of the matter is that very basic sorts of care are not available in time to prevent death.
So, Mark, how about eliminating Medicare? Why should those older Americans be allowed to mooch off of the taxpayers?
What’s the obsession with toenails? Anyway, so let me get this straight. A citizen of the United States is telling a citizen of the United Kingdom how bad the health care in the U.K. is? Okay, Mark, for that you need to cite some facts. Just saying it’s so doesn’t wash in this case.
westmich,
I can offer you the benefit of my living in Canada for the first 26 years of my life. I can assure you from my PERSONAL experience that there is a huge difference between Universal Health Coverage and Universal Health Care. Sure, all Canadians have health coverage but one in five have no access to a primary care physician. 20% of Canadians must wait hours at a public health clinic to have their minor maladies dealt with.
What cost to the country’s economy is in that?
I have waited over 7 weeks for surgery on a knee ligament due to a waiting list. Sure I was covered but I could not get care.
I know of a friend who was in hospital for surgery and never saw the inside of a hospital room.
Sure you can pitch Universal Health Care all you want when in fact you really mean Universal Health Coverage because once you get the government involved the rationing begins and the care part of the equation suffers.
Are there fine physicians in Canada? Of course. One of them is my cousin and another one is his wife.
All I know is after 26 years in the Canadian Health “Care” System I feel incredibly lucky to live in this country and enjoy the benefits of the US health care system.
Just last weekend my son received a cut above his eye and needed four stitches. Off to the hospital we go. Within 15 minutes we are in a treatment room and within 45 minutes my son has received his sutures and a nice toy for his troubles. Cost out of pocket? $10.
In Canada? That would have been a 6-8 hour ordeal easily. Cost out of pocket? $0.
For ten bucks? You’re kidding right?
GOP4ME,
Thank you for the information from personal experience. That’s always better than just simply declaring something is so without offering either direct knowledge or some kind of neutral source of information.
Mark said….
“A right is something that a human being can at least potentially do on his own – heart surgery doesn’t fit into such a catagory.”
So the right thing was done in letting Terri Schiavo RIP. Do coma patients have a right to life since they can’t live on their own?