Why I Support Israel and the Jews

With the nomination of Chuck Hagel to Defense Secretary, the issue of Israel and America’s relationship with her is squarely on the table and so I think it an appropriate time to re-state my views.

As for Hagel, himself, I don’t have much of a concern, one way or the other.  He’s clearly not qualified to be Secretary of Defense but, then again, we can say that about pretty much all of Obama’s nominees (the only two who had a shred of credibility in their posts were former CIA Director Petraeus and outgoing SecDef Panetta).  Hagel also has clearly stupid views about Iran and what our policy towards the Muslim powers should be but, once again, that is common for Obama Administration officials.  In Hagel we’ll get a man who doesn’t know how to do his assigned job and who will bring to his job a set of beliefs which are divorced from reality:  the Obama Administration in a nutshell.  But there is something disturbing in Hagel’s apparent views about the Jews and Israel.

There seems to be a gigantic shift in views about Israel and the Jews going on.  I won’t call it so much a throwback to the old anti-Semitism but, rather, just a resurfacing of anti-Semitism which never died out.  Think about it – Hagel, himself, has complained about the “Jewish lobby” and its influence on American policy, and that is nothing more than a re-phrasing of a thousand statements by Hitler and his minions about the baleful influence of the Jews and how Germany must be protected against the machinations of the Jews.  For some reason, hating Jews and being worried about their alleged influence is a hardy perennial among people – and for those who try to ascribe it to some particularly Christian ideal, I point that ancient pagans felt the same sort of hostility and, of course, modern pagans called communists, fascists and Nazis have been hostile to Jews to one degree or another.  The bottom line is that anti-Semitism is back, in force, and is steadily gaining in social respectability.

I can only assume that this anti-Semitism was latent all along – that even among those who most earnestly spoke of their friendship for the Jews when the Holocaust was a recent memory there were, even then, people still harboring some sort of lingering resentment towards the Jews.  It may have been that only because we had 6,000,000 fresh corpses lying about that people muted their anti-Semitism…but now that memories have faded and, also, the drip, drip, drip of Holocaust-denial poison has worked in to the social fabric, it is becoming easier to be openly ant-Semitic.  All of this helped along, of course, by a well-financed (by Muslims) narrative about Israeli treatment of the Palestinians…all those stories of anti-Muslim persecution by rich, brutal Jews.  Also helped along because the Israelis, themselves, are human beings and thus prone to mistakes – and each Israeli mistake becomes set in stone as supposed proof of Israeli evil.

At this moment in time, Israel cannot count on a friend in the world – there is not a single European nation which would stick its neck out for Israel and while Obama is President even American support is of a doubtful quantity.  Meanwhile, even those few Muslim States which had worked out a livable relationship with Israel (most notably Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Egypt) show themselves increasingly hostile.  The majority of the American people back Israel, of course, but that is not too useful when the levers of power are controlled by people who don’t back Israel.

So, why do I support Israel and the Jews?  Because Jews are people and deserve to live.  It really just comes down to that.  You can’t sell me on any notion that the Jews are some kind of invader in Israel and have no right to be there – if we’re to do a title search on land ownership then no nation out there is going to survive.  And not just us with our questionable title to our land but, heck, the Poles don’t want too close an inquiry in to who owns Silesia, the Russians have a lot of explaining to do about Karelia and the Kalingrad Oblast…and, of course, the Muslims most loud in their shouts of returned land really need to explain why they are in Constantinople and Alexandria.  It is what it is and people are where they are – and most Israeli Jews are native born and have never lived anywhere else.

I support Israel because they are civilized and democratic.  Show me a civilized and/or democratic enemy of Israel.  You can’t.  One and all, the nations which want to destroy Israel are tyrannies and are barbaric.  When was the last time a Christian church was burned down in Israel?  Any Christian community attacked and massacred in Israel of late?  The Christian community of Israel is growing, the Christian community of the Muslim world is shrinking.  Jews, Christians and Muslims can all vote in Israeli elections, serve in Israeli government and live their lives as they see fit…in Muslim nations Christians can be murdered for just being Christian.  Who’s side should any civilized man be on in this battle?  Can anyone rationally tell me that if Muslims were given control of Israel tomorrow that they’d allow equal civil rights to non-Muslims?

Supporting Israel is a no-brainer.  Its not something open to rational debate. The Israelis prove themselves, each day, to be better than their enemies.  Until their enemies rise to Israeli standards, there is nothing for it but for rational people to back Israel to the hilt.  And so I shall – and if the Muslims really want to fight this thing out (and I do believe that at least a large portion of them do) then I believe that Israel – and the United States – should eventually oblige their desire and make them pay the price for their barbarism and tyranny.

27 thoughts on “Why I Support Israel and the Jews

  1. pelirrojito January 8, 2013 / 3:09 pm

    A couple of questions,

    When has he ever said he wants to destroy Israel? You make it sounds like he believes Israel shouldn’t exist.

    What criticism of Israel is acceptable in your opinion? Should everyone just agree with everything Israel says and does?

    You’re right that they live there now, and very very few people would ever suggest they should be removed. Although you yourself have stated various times that you think the world (or just the US?) should simply walk into Muslim countries and partition them, giving parts to Christians (and where does this idea that a country should be determined by a religion come from?).

    • dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 3:38 pm

      Two little issues here with your comment “denounces the Palestinians when they ask for their right of return” James.

      First there are no such people as the Palestinians–they are Jordanians, Syrians and Egyptians who usurped the name. Second, after the Arab nations lost the war against Israel (IIRC, the 6-day war in 1967) those that wanted to stay in Israel were allowed to stay. Now they believe they have a “right” to return. Why? Not working out well when your leaders live like Kings and you are starving?

    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:29 pm

      such ignorance, and lack of history……

      This is an important book because it explicitly addresses common German/European misconceptions about Islamism and the Middle East conflict and counters them with documented, factual information.

      Küntzel’s aim is to correct views that have become conventional wisdom in the West. He traces the history of Islamism (radical, militant Islam) from its modern beginnings with Hassan al-Banna in the 1920s in Egypt and the Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin al-Husseini, in Mandatory Palestine until today’s Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas, and Al Qaeda. This trend, he shows, is inherently anti-Semitic and pursues its ideological agenda through murder and violence.

      Küntzel points out that Islamism would not have succeeded without the combination of al-Banna and Husseini. In the latter half of the 1930s, they received financial and ideological assistance from Nazi

      http://www.jcpa.org/phas/phas-eiteneier-s06.htmGermany, and after World War II were aided by Nazis brought to Egypt.

    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:34 pm

      jimmah…SASAN = (goat herder)

      <"you dehumanize others because it suits your religious views".

      No THEY dehumanize themselves BECAUSE of THEIR ACTS.
      “You will know them by their fruits” and their fruits are…………..


    • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 4:51 pm


      I know the Muslims and so I know they will keep attacking – my current view is just about a complete US withdrawal from the area. If by some chance that gets them to calm down as start to be civilized, great. But I don’t expect it – it is in the nature of Islam to attack…it is why Syria and Turkey are Muslim, today. So, they will attack – and when they do attack, again, I want it to be a war to the finish…and, yes, that would mean eventual partition and exchanges of population to ensure that all non-Muslim people are free from Muslim control.

      • pelirrojito January 8, 2013 / 9:43 pm

        You haven’t answered the questions. What criticisms about Israel are acceptable to you? and when did he ever say he was against the existence of Israel?

      • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 10:29 pm


        Never said he was against the existence of Israel – as I said, I’m pretty indifferent to Hagel. I guess, though, what the left wants is to fight against a certain accusation against Hagel. I refuse to be drawn.

        What is unacceptable is anti-Semitism…and to say there is a “Jewish lobby” which is baleful when there are 10,000 other lobbies is absurd. There are Jewish groups which seek to influence the policy of the United States government. Just as there are black groups, Latino groups, feminist groups, Christian groups, environmentalist groups…to single out the Jews as baleful is anti-Semitic. Either all lobbies are bad or none of them are intrinsically so. Pick which one – you either want them all gone (including those you are ideologically in tune with) or you want them all to stay.

    • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 4:53 pm


      If a “right of return” is legitimate then I expect you to firmly insist that Germans have a right of return to Silesia.

      As for my support of Israel: religion has nothing to do with it. Israel is civilized. Israel’s enemies are barbarians. I always back civilization against barbarism.

    • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 5:21 pm

      Because it does.

      According to the 2008 Israeli census, 71% of the Jews of Israel were born in Israel. That is nearly 4 million of Israel’s 5.7 million Jews. Where are they to “return” to? They’ve never been anywhere else.

      Less than 1% of the population of the West Bank and Gaza is over 65 years of age – and you’d have to be that age or older to be a Palestinian who can “return” to Israel…the rest were all born outside of Israel and thus can’t “return” anywhere. And, of course, not all of those over 65 were in Israel, proper, in 1948. We’re talking a fraction of a percent of the Palestinian people who can realistically be considered “returnees”. What “right of return” means is “shove as many Muslims as necessary in to Israel until 51% of the population is Muslim”.

      Do keep in mind that I fully understand every last aspect of the issue and there’s nothing you can bring up which will change the facts. As an aside, if you wish to assert that “right of return” crosses generational lines then I want to “return” to Constantinople and have a Mass in Hagia Sophia…you get the Muslims to agree to that and we’ll talk.

    • dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 5:23 pm


      The first rule of holes is to quit digging; however, I will address your response in part.
      “ah, the classic argument of conservative religious members of the GOP.
      They aren’t people! they don’t count!
      …yada, yada, yada…
      You say that Israel allowed people to stay there after they won the war..sure they did, but they had to live under Israeli occupation and rule…would you agree to that?
      you dehumanize others because it suits your religious views.”

      You start with a multi=pronged falsehood with “conservative religious members of the GOP” I am a fiscal conservative, would probably be listed as an agnostic and do not belong to or wholeheartedly agree with most of the GOP. Wrong on 3 for 3–great start.

      –“They aren’t people! they don’t count!” Please show me where I said anything of the sort. Same with your last comment.

      –“but they had to live under Israeli occupation and rule…would you agree to that?” Not sure, wasn’t there however those that did stay are free citizens in all aspects including religion. You do realize who controls the Dome of the Rock–don’t you? Nevertheless, the “Palestinians” are “free” to be human shields for the cowards that shoot rockets every day. I am sure you view that as “freedom” because you constantly harp here about “The One we have all been waiting for” and in defense of his constant trashing of our Constitution. You are one to surrender your freedoms for a “perceived” security.

      –you dehumanize others because it suits your religious views–comprehend the above and I will accept this as your surrender. It is like when I am called a ‘racist’ these days–it only means two things; I am arguing with an Obama voter, and they have just lost the argument.

      Maybe you can ask your Muslim handlers to “stop shooting and maybe we can talk” It would go a long way towards peace which is something they are not looking for.

    • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 6:13 pm


      How can people born in a particular place come from somewhere else? You’re from the place you’re from – I’m from the United States. I was born here. There is no other place I can be from. 71% of all Jews currently living in Israel were born there – they have no place else they can be from. If you move them back to the place where their parents, grand parents or great-grandparents came from you aren’t moving them “back” but moving them “to”.

      Some of the Jews of Israel, of course, are descended from people who never, ever left Israel…not since the time of the Exodus. Others are descended from people who started to arrive late in the 19th century. A great many of the “Palestinians” are also descended from people who moved to what is today Israel in the late 19th and early 20th centuries as the Jews – by hard work – started to make it a place to move to. It was a burned-over wasteland before the Jews returned with not even a tenth of today’s population back in the 1880’s. It had nothing but decayed since the end of Christian rule in the 7th century…slowly and steadily, the Muslim masters of the land allowed irrigation and roads to disintegrate and population consequently continually declined from its ancient peak…only when the Jews started to come back and started to build did the Muslim population start to increase. Since we’re to work on “right of return”, shouldn’t those “Palestinians” who can’t prove descent from “Palestinians” resident in the area prior to, say, 1880 also be forced out?

      You’re just talking a lot of nonsense – justifying your desire for Israel to be destroyed and dressing it up as an act of “justice”.

    • dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 6:20 pm

      Okay James,

      There is no such thing as a “Palestinian” people–it does not mean they are not people. The name “Palestinian” was chosen as a direct snub to the Jews. These are facts.

      I have no direct experience with what happened after the Six-Day war–do you? Don’t speak from experience you do not have and without first-hand vetted sources–that is what you are doing. I do know that all the people of Israel are free within my memory and knowledge from my visit there a couple of years ago.

      “because you can’t win an election” — Once again the lack of wisdom comes through because as usual you are wrong. I was not speaking of elections.

      Racist is the call of surrender of the Left–I was using it as an analogy. Just so you know, I am not a racist, I do not have an inferiority (specially compared to you) complex, and once again I guess I will be called to protect your whiny little ass one day soon.

      BTW, the reason I mention “handlers” is because you can never appear to think for yourself but rather do nothing more than regurgitate those views fed to you by your masters aka. handlers.

  2. dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 3:52 pm

    But Mark, a couple of easily found articles on line today show that the “Palestinians” are just lovely fuzzy people looking for peace. It must be Israel’s fault the rockets land in the territories on their children.

    Wife of Hamas Politician Says Woman’s Role Is to Instill Love of Jihad and Martyrdom in Her Children

    Women in Palestine play a great role in raising their children and in encouraging them to wage Jihad for the sake of Allah. This is absolutely the most glorious thing a woman can do.

    Palestinian Authority Chief Judge: ‘Jerusalem Will Be the Capital of the Caliphate’

    Palestinian Authority Chief Islamic Judge Tayseer Al-Tamimi uttered these words on Azhari TV on December 31, 2012:

    The caliphate will be restored after this tyrannical rule comes to an end… What we are seeing in Egypt are birth pangs. The struggle between Islam and others, and all the conspiracies that aim at stopping the train that has already set out to liberate Jerusalem and to restore Islamic rule. Jerusalem will be the capital of the caliphate, Allah willing… That is why I say that it is imperative to awaken the nation, because it has the capabilities. It is imperative to awaken the nation to its duty to liberate the land of Jerusalem and Palestine – the land of the Prophet Muhammad’s nocturnal journal – using all its capabilities.

    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:18 pm

      progressiveism = socialism = marxism = communism = KILL JEWS, couple that with islam and their intertwining with the nazis = Kill Jews.

      TRUTH =


      Please Note: The terms B.C. (Before Christ or Before the Christian Era) and A.D.(“Anno Domini” Latin for “In the Year of Our Lord”) have been replaced with B.C.E (Before Common, or Christian, Era) and C.E. (Common, or Christian, Era) so as to respect all visitors to this site. The terms are interchangeable and both are based upon the Gregorian Calendar.

      These and other questions will be addressed more fully as you go through this website. However, there is a preliminary historical fact that must be established now. There has never been a civilization or a nation referred to as “Palestine” and the very notion of a “Palestinian Arab nation” having ancient attachments to the Holy Land going back to time immemorial is one of the biggest hoaxes ever perpetrated upon the world! There is not, nor has there ever been, a distinct “Palestinian” culture or language. Further, there has never been a Palestinian state governed BY Arab Palestinians in history, nor was there ever a serious Arab-Palestinian national movement until 1964… three years BEFORE the Arabs of “Palestine” lost the West Bank [Judea and Samaria] and Gaza as a result of the 1967 Six-Day War (which the Arabs started). Even the so-called leader of the “Palestinian” people, Yasser Arafat, is EGYPTIAN! In short, the so-called Arab “Palestinians” are a manufactured people…a people with no history and no authenticity… whose sole purpose for existence is to destroy the Jewish State!


    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:21 pm

      Israel is one of the tiniest nations on the face of the earth… only about 8,000 sq. miles, 2½ times the size of Rhode Island and only slightly larger than the Canary Islands!. It is only 260 miles at its longest, has a 112-mile coastline, 60 miles at its widest, and between 3 and 9 miles at its narrowest! A very high-powered rifle could launch a projectile right across the country! This is particularly frightening when one considers that 65% of Israel’s population is within this 9-mile wide section (Tel Aviv area). Yet Arab propagandists call Israel “expansionist” and the “aggressor” against all Arab peoples. For those unfamiliar with the Arab interpretation of “aggressor,” it means one who dares fight back against Arab aggression!! So even though Israel may have fought only defensive wars, the mere fact that she resisted total destruction is viewed as an “act of aggression.” That’s a case of wacky logic but, unfortunately, Israel doesn’t have the luxury of picking her enemies!


    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:24 pm


      The Arabs and/or Muslims of today control 22 nations… 99½ percent of the ENTIRE Middle East land mass while Israel occupies only a 1/2% Arabs are Green with Envy of 1 percent speck on this same map.

      But that’s still too much land for the Arabs to spare. They want it all. How often have we heard their familiar cry,

      “We will fight to our last drop of blood for for every last grain of sand!” And that is ultimately what all the fighting is about today. And no matter how many land concessions the Israelis might make for “peace,” it will never be enough! Any peace treaty between Israel and the Arab world are ultimately meaningless. The most recent 1993 “Oslo Peace Accord” has brought nothing but homicidal bombers into Israel. Even the Israeli-Egyptian and Israeli-Jordanian peace treaties are holding on by a single thread and, if you were to read their government-controlled newspapers, you’d think they were still at war with Israel!

    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 4:38 pm


      which you know will never happen….

      right after the abomination of desolation (dome of the rockHeads) is vaporized.

    • M. Noonan January 8, 2013 / 4:55 pm


      That is pretty much just how they are – conquering non-Muslims is commanded as a moral duty among Muslims. Now, maybe they’ll have a change of heart and stop it…but I don’t expect it to be so.

      • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 5:31 pm

        On November 29, 1947, the United Nations General Assembly adopted Resolution 181 (also known as the Partition Resolution) that would divide Great Britain’s former Palestinian mandate into Jewish and Arab states in May 1948. Under the resolution, the area of religious significance surrounding Jerusalem would remain under international control administered by the United Nations. The Palestinian Arabs refused to recognize this arrangement, which they regarded as favorable to the Jews and unfair to the Arab population that would remain in Jewish territory under the partition. The United States sought a middle way by supporting the United Nations resolution, but also encouraging negotiations between Arabs and Jews in the Middle East.

        The United Nations resolution sparked conflict between Jewish and Arab groups within Palestine. Fighting began with attacks by irregular bands of Palestinian Arabs attached to local units of the Arab Liberation Army composed of volunteers from Palestine and neighboring Arab countries. These groups launched their attacks against Jewish cities, settlements, and armed forces. The Jewish forces were composed of the Haganah, the underground militia of the Jewish community in Palestine, and two small irregular groups, the Irgun, and LEHI. The goal of the Arabs was initially to block the Partition Resolution and to prevent the establishment of the Jewish state. The Jews, on the other hand, hoped to gain control over the territory allotted to them under the Partition Plan.

        After Israel declared its independence on May 14, 1948, the fighting intensified with other Arab forces joining the Palestinian Arabs in attacking territory in the former Palestinian mandate. On the eve of May 14, the Arabs launched an air attack on Tel Aviv, which the Israelis resisted. This action was followed by the invasion of the former Palestinian mandate by Arab armies from Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, and Egypt. Saudi Arabia sent a formation that fought under the Egyptian command. British trained forces from Transjordan eventually intervened in the conflict, but only in areas that had been designated as part of the Arab state under the United Nations Partition Plan and the corpus separatum of Jerusalem. After tense early fighting, Israeli forces, now under joint command, were able to gain the offensive.

        Though the United Nations brokered two cease-fires during the conflict, fighting continued into 1949. Israel and the Arab states did not reach any formal armistice agreements until February. Under separate agreements between Israel and the neighboring states of Egypt, Lebanon, Transjordan, and Syria, these bordering nations agreed to formal armistice lines. Israel gained some territory formerly granted to Palestinian Arabs under the United Nations resolution in 1947. Egypt and Jordan retained control over the Gaza Strip and the West Bank respectively. These armistice lines held until 1967. The United States did not become directly involved with the armistice negotiations, but hoped that instability in the Middle East would not interfere with the international balance of power between the Soviet Union and the United States. The Arab-Israeli War of 1948 ultimately led to the displacement of hundreds of thousands of Palestinian Arabs.


      • dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 5:49 pm

        Honestly Mark (as I am soon to be called a “warmonger”) I do not see an end to this prior to a crusade to end it once and for all. I cannot believe how our younger generation (US) no longer has a respect for life; nevertheless, (to paraphrase badly) the Israel-“Palestinian” conflict will not end without complete submission and/or when the “Palestinians” learn to love their children more than they love death.

    • dbschmidt January 8, 2013 / 5:31 pm

      No James,

      If I have a dog in this fight it would be that Jerusalem and the Jews therein are a civilized people as are the majority of the citizens there no matter their religion. They are a democracy bordering on a republic which is the only one of its kind in the region.

      I want peace in the region; however, the Muslims do not. Wonder why I side with Israel? If you haven’t figured it out–you never will. Look up Caliphate sometime.

    • neocon01 January 8, 2013 / 5:46 pm

      this is what happens when you wage six wars and LOSE them all….

  3. dennis1again January 9, 2013 / 9:24 pm

    Mark, I come back here after months to find you’ve now got posts to imaginary people, but no dissent whatsoever. Where’s James? Is he a figment of someone’s imagination? Why do we see only your remarks to him – are you just talking to yourselves here? Have your contrarians given up on you? Or do their ideas constitute such a threat to your own positions they must not be seen or heard? No doubt my post will be eliminated straightway as well – but maybe you’ll get a chance to see it before it’s wiped off your site. Heaven forfend that any of your readers should encounter an opinion at variance with the Grand Masters of Blogs For Victory.

    You say, “Do keep in mind that I fully understand every last aspect of the issue and there’s nothing you can bring up which will change the facts.” Yes, I will keep that in mind as it’s an impressive claim. But please allow me to remind you of several facts you seem to be ignoring. First, not many rational people these days buy your accusations of hatred. Hating Jews is really a canard here in the U.S. – do you seriously believe Israel’s western critics oppose their policies out of any kind of hatred, let alone of ethnicity? After all there are so many different kinds of Jews – orthodox religious Jews, secular Jews, liberal Jews, right-wing Zionist Jews and the list goes on. They are hardly a monolithic bloc to lump together as you do; this is a disservice that in some fundamental way dehumanizes all Jews – as if they are not individual people who define themselves all kinds of ways.

    As for the state of Israel the primary opposition most western critics (including many Jews) have is with the policies of the extremists and nationalists who presently dominate the Knesset (between the Likud and Yisrael Beiteinu parties they control 42 seats). Hardly all Israelis are in that camp; certainly not all Jews are. And please, Hagel cannot be compared to Hitler. You trigger Godwin’s Law by invoking Hitler in such a knee-jerk fashion. Face it, AIPAC (and yes, it is a Jewish lobby, although it certainly doesn’t represent the views of all Jews) is one of the most powerful lobbies in Washington – and there is no good reason any foreign organization should be permitted the degree of influence in vetting American legislators or policy decisions as AIPAC has. But it has nothing to do with race; it’s because they represent another country’s national interests.

    So you really ought to step back from your basic premise of anti-Semitism and acknowledge that opposition toward Israel isn’t race-based, it is largely policy- based. Once that fact is established, you can begin to have a rational conversation about the best policy course for the United States vis a vis Israel. What exactly is in our national interest in our relationship with this foreign entity? It is an ally, yes, but one with a dubious record when it comes to American interests. Unanswered question go way back to 1967 when Israel committed an outrageous act of war against the United States, bombing the USS Liberty and killing twice as many Americans as al Qaeda killed when they bombed the USS Cole (with more than four times as many casualties). If we support Israel, do they support us, or feel they can abuse or manipulate us with impunity? These are practical questions that have nothing to do with race or ethnicity, but principle.

    You say Israel is civilized and democratic, but there is a strong case that Israel in fact has been an apartheid state from its very charter and founding. There are credible and grave accusations of collective punishment against Palestinian communities and other crimes against humanity that never have been sufficiently addressed by Congress, that rightfully should have bearing on U.S. policies and responses to Israel and its actions. It is facile and evades matters of great substance to simply accuse Israel’s critics of anti-Semitism when the reality is of a different nature altogether.

    It may be true that Israel’s Arab neighbors hate Jews, but after decades of IDF killing Arabs with impunity, even in refugee camps, taking their homes by force, bulldozing their olive groves and vineyards and depriving them of basic human needs and rights, although hatred may not be morally defensible at least it is humanly understandable. We still hear about the Munich Olympics, an atrocity by any standard – but how many people even know about the Sabra and Shatila massacres, where many times more innocent Arab civilians were butchered mercilessly, including women, children and the aged, with the oversight of IDF? Israel always kills many times more others, than are killed of their own people by anyone else. The list of unredressed grievances against Israel and their crimes against humanity is quite long. If you “fully understand every last aspect of the issue” then you know this is true, but you willfully ignore it.

    This is one of several reasons why many patriotic Americans welcome the appointment of Hagel as defense secretary. It will be refreshing to have at least one cabinet official who is not invested in all the heroic myths and outright poppycock regarding Israel’s untouchable and immaculate moral status, who holds them to rational scrutiny and criticism as we should hold any other state. No matter now absurdly you romanticize them, “Israel and the Jews” are no better and no worse than the rest of humanity.

    • M. Noonan January 9, 2013 / 9:29 pm


      Opposition to Israel, though, always ends up in anti-Semitism…this is clear because Israel’s enemies are so clearly absolutely evil that to try and find a “balance” between them or to think that both sides in the dispute have an equally good case, you have to think that the Israelis are as evil as their enemies…something clearly divorced from the facts and which can only be based on sheer ignorance or race-hatred (or, more often, both).

      As soon as the Muslims have a democratically governed State for a couple decades and this State doesn’t launch any terrorist attacks on Israel (nor allow others to do so) then you’ll start to have an argument that there is a bit of equality between Israel and her enemies and thus opposition to Israel, at that point, might not be based on anti-Semitism. But that is a long way off.

    • Amazona January 9, 2013 / 11:00 pm

      Well, denny, I see your blatant and hateful bigotry has not abated during your unlamented absence.

      You have, however, honed your whining skills to a new level. You must be very proud.

      I note that any post on Israel brings out the haters and the bigots, so your popping up now is no surprise.

    • Amazona January 9, 2013 / 11:05 pm

      “The Lebanese Christian Phalangist militia was responsible for the massacres that occurred at the two Beirut-area refugee camps on September 16-17, 1982. Israeli troops allowed the Phalangists to enter Sabra and Shatila to root out terrorist cells believed located there. It had been estimated that there may have been up to 200 armed men in the camps working out of the countless bunkers built by the PLO over the years, and stocked with generous reserves of ammunition.

      When Israeli soldiers ordered the Phalangists out, they found hundreds dead (estimates range from 460 according to the Lebanese police, to 700-800 calculated by Israeli intelligence). The dead, according to the Lebanese account, included 35 women and children. The rest were men: Palestinians, Lebanese, Pakistanis, Iranians, Syrians and Algerians. The killings came on top of an estimated 95,000 deaths that had occurred during the civil war in Lebanon from 1975-1982.

      The killings were perpetrated to avenge the murders of Lebanese President Bashir Gemayel and 25 of his followers, killed in a bomb attack earlier that week.

      Israel had allowed the Phalange to enter the camps as part of a plan to transfer authority to the Lebanese, and accepted responsibility for that decision. The Kahan Commission of Inquiry, formed by the Israeli government in response to public outrage and grief, found that Israel was indirectly responsible for not anticipating the possibility of Phalangist violence. Israel instituted the panel’s recommendations, including the dismissal of Gen. Raful Eitan, the Army Chief of Staff. Defense Minister Ariel Sharon resigned.

      The Kahan Commission, declared former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, was “a great tribute to Israeli democracy….There are very few governments in the world that one can imagine making such a public investigation of such a difficult and shameful episode.”

      Ironically, while 300,000 Israelis demonstrated in Israel to protest the killings, little or no reaction occurred in the Arab world. Outside the Middle East, a major international outcry against Israel erupted over the massacres. The Phalangists, who perpetrated the crime, were spared the brunt of the condemnations for it.

      By contrast, few voices were raised in May 1985, when Muslim militiamen attacked the Shatila and Burj-el Barajneh Palestinian refugee camps. According to UN officials, 635 were killed and 2,500 wounded. During a two-year battle between the Syrian-backed Shiite Amal militia and the PLO, more than 2,000, including many civilians, were reportedly killed. No outcry was directed at the PLO or the Syrians and their allies over the slaughter. International reaction was also muted in October 1990 when Syrian forces overran Christian-controlled areas of Lebanon. In the eight-hour clash, 700 Christians were killed-the worst single battle of Lebanon’s Civil War.”

      From the Jewish Virtual Library

    • neocon01 January 11, 2013 / 4:09 pm


      BS as usual….

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