Open Thread

After Trump has his announcement speech, quite a bit of Catholic Twitter had a debate about Trump’s call to execute drug dealers. As you might recall, I long ago decided to oppose the death penalty. My grounds for that were that mercy should always triumph over justice and that I don’t really trust the government with the power to execute citizens. I’m still of that opinion but the debate got me thinking.

A hundred thousand people died of drug overdoses in the USA in the year ending April of 2021. That was a big jump – more than 25 percent – from the year before. But lets say the jump was temporary and in a normal year 70,000 die. That’s still a lot. More than 190 a day. And that doesn’t cover all the drug deaths – we’d also have to include all murders related in the first or second degree to drugs (ie, drug trade people killing each other over drugs as well as drug addicts who commit crimes – including murder – to support their addiction). Any way you slice it, that’s a lot of stiffs.

How many people would die of drug overdoses next year if this year we hung a thousand drug dealers?

It needs to be thought about. A lot of people are in the drug trade because it is a low-risk, high profit enterprise. They start tuning in each day to see a couple drug dealers were hanged, it might make them seek other lines of work. Can anyone know for certain that we wouldn’t immediately get a thousand replacements for the thousand we hung? No. But suppose we did so and it made it 50 percent less likely that a druggie can get his drugs at any given time? Hang 1,000 criminals, save 35,000 lives?

What it comes down to is how we will view both Justice and Mercy. I have my growing suspicion that softness on crime is neither Just nor Merciful – and not only unjust and merciless to the victims, but especially unjust and merciless to the criminal. I do believe it is crucial to provide a way out even for the worst criminals…but by the time we’re on a guy’s fifth arrest for drug dealing, I think we might be dealing with someone rather incorrigible. It is something to think about.

Looks like the House will be a 222-213 split. The GOP is pledging investigations of Biden and we’ll see if they really do it or just go through the motions. Meanwhile the bed-wetters are upset with us – saying that we should ignore Biden’s crimes and get legislating! Morons. The last thing we want is legislation – though we do look forward to zeroing out the budget for the Special Counsel Garland just appointed to investigate Trump for the millionth time. Also those 87,000 new IRS agents. The Special Counsel was appointed, by the way, to give the MSM something else to report about if the House investigations of Biden prove to have teeth.

Maricopa – it was either cheating or the most fabulously incompetent election ever held. And don’t think that people won’t be purposefully incompetent. It is nearly as effective as box-stuffing and if done right it keeps you away from any legal jeopardy. Bottom line: cheating or incompetence kept Kari Lake out of the governorship. And as the person running the election was Lake’s opponent…kinda makes you go with cheating-via-incompetence. Certainly Abe Hamadeh coming up just short after late ballot drops is highly suspicious…but if you’re cheating the new governor in you’d better make sure you cheat in your guy as AG. No doubt things are screwy – the good news is that Hobbs is a zero and her legislature will be GOP controlled.

Elon Musk is conducting a poll on Twitter about reinstating Trump – as of this moment, 3.9 million votes, 56 percent for reinstating Trump but that is down from 60 percent earlier.

38 thoughts on “Open Thread

  1. Tim November 19, 2022 / 1:12 am

    This is a quotation from someone on twitter,

    “BREAKING: Cochise County BOS just motioned to table the certification of the election until November 28th, when they expect to review all evidence of the proof of legal certification by the accredited Election Assistance Commissio labs to use the tabulation machines.

    This now establishes precedent to do the same in other counties now that Cochise County is validating their results. Arizona cannot certify any election results until all counties have rendered certified results.”

    It would appear that the Kari Lake saga is not over.

    • fortyacresbeyond November 19, 2022 / 4:35 pm

      Tim, the quotation isn’t from just “someone on twitter.” It comes from Mark Finchem, the nutjob who lost his election for Arizona Secretary of State.

      • Cluster November 20, 2022 / 9:27 am

        It’s not a quote – it’s a statement of fact

        On Saturday, Assistant Attorney General Jennifer Wright wrote to one of the county’s top election officials detailing reports of a string of irregularities from printer problems that stopped ballots being tabulated, to confusion about procedures for transferring voters to alternate sites if they were unable to vote at the first location. … Wright says: ‘These complaints go beyond pure speculation, but include first-hand witness accounts that raise concerns regarding Maricopa’s lawful compliance with Arizona election law.’

        Democrats stole this election too

      • Cluster November 20, 2022 / 7:01 pm

        I think it was your gal pal Hillary Clinton who first said, “you can run the best campaign and still have the election stolen from you”. Remember that?

        Fuck off

      • Tim November 20, 2022 / 8:20 pm

        “It is a verbatim quote from election denier and election loser Mark Finchem.”

        Election denier…

        You mean like gore in 2000?
        kerry in 2004?
        hillzebub in 2016?

        Election denier?
        You mean like abrahms in the Georgia 2016 elections?

        I have two words for you and your election denialism.


      • Tim November 21, 2022 / 12:16 am

        Please show me what words President Trump stated that led to any rioting. Then please tell me why the capitol police still refuse to distribute all the footage of this so called “insurrection” that they have.

        Before you try to move the goal posts again, please provide the names of all those killed during that day. As far as I can find, two were murdered. Both by the police. Just to make sure the goal posts stay firmly rooted where they are now, if you like the complete autopsy for sicknick can be provided.

        Natural causes got him. Not any rioter.

        Say hello to all your friends in the proud boys. How many fibbies were members anyway? Then you can ask ray epps what he was doing that day. Known informant urging people to riot?

        You have a day, okay?

      • Tim November 21, 2022 / 8:57 am

        You can find these if you want to. I would link them but it is time to use that mass of “what evs” you have inside your head.

        “The last time Trump was on twitter, his supporters stormed the Capitol!”

        What actually was said.
        Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump · Jan 6, 2021
        I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!

        Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump · Jan 6, 2021
        Please support our Capitol Police and Law Enforcement. They are truly on the side of our Country. Stay peaceful!

      • Amazona November 21, 2022 / 10:06 am

        Oh, Tim, haven’t you learned by now? These trolls don’t care about facts, or truth.

        What is so funny is watching them being led around by the rings in their noses by the Left and its lapdog media, actually proud of the nonsense they obediently regurgitate after slurping it up from the Agenda Media troughs.

        The Left needs Trump. Without Trump to function as full-time scapegoat and focus of attention, people might start to look a little more closely at the real problems we have. The Left understands the pathology of its base and its need to hate and sneer, and feeds them Trump 24/7 to keep that hate buzzing. We, on the other hand, sit back and watch the sad silly little puppets dancing on the ends of their strings, giddy with the spite and malice that define them as they rush to sites like this to deposit their little hate nuggets.

      • fortyacresbeyond November 21, 2022 / 1:54 pm

        “Please show me what words President Trump stated that led to any rioting.” Please watch the January 6 Committee public hearings.

        “Before you try to move the goal posts again, please provide the names of all those killed during that day.” Talk about moving the goal posts.

        The fact is, Trump supporters violently attacked the Capitol of the United States in an effort to prevent the Electoral Votes from being counted. And when those supporters plead guilty to their crimes, or are sentenced after conviction, they invariably blame Trump for their actions. Even his own vice president knows that Trump was largely to blame, writing that Trump’s “reckless words had endangered my family and all those serving at the Capitol.”

      • Mark Noonan November 21, 2022 / 5:30 pm

        LOL – watch the J6 hearings. You may as well ask us to accept the New York Times or MSNBC as a source.

        And there was no violent attack – just people wandering around. The only person killed was an unarmed woman shot unjustly by the Capitol Police. It was a set up from start to finish – with FBI agents provoking action and Nancy making sure the people could get in.

      • Amazona November 21, 2022 / 7:31 pm

        Have you noticed the total lack of information about how the Capitol doors got opened? The original implication was that they were forced by a mob, but when it turned out that they weigh tons and are locked with magnetic locks that can only be unlocked by a qualified person in a secure booth inside the building, using a special key to activate the unlocking mechanism, suddenly there was complete silence about the invasion of the building and a switch to the alleged motives of the crowd.


        But you have to admit, the footage of those aged Americans wandering around in confusion was chilling. The loitering—-oh, the horror!

      • Amazona November 21, 2022 / 7:23 pm

        The reason Trump supporters went to the Capitol was to show their support for the request to delay certification for the specific and finite period of ten days, to allow some time to start examining some of the allegations of fraud in the election. The only argument left to the mouth breathers is the one forty obediently regurgitates here—-” in an effort to prevent the Electoral Votes from being counted”. To the Left, a partial truth is fine, so they carefully edit out the words that would, if included, prove them to be liars. If one of them were to accidentally be honest, we would see a statement like ” in an effort to prevent the Electoral Votes from being counted for another ten days”—but where’s the fun in that?

        How many true Trump supporters got violent on January 6? As far as I can tell, very few. One, for example, was accused of being violent when he fell onto a cop who had been knocked down and then tried to help the cop get back on his feet while protecting him from rioters, telling the cop “I’m one of you, I’m trying to help you” and the cop replied “I know. Thank you.” But the video of the Trump supporter on top of the cop, with both of them struggling to get up, is all that the haters needed to cast this man as a troublemaker.

        It’s the passionate addiction to the ugliest, most vile, interpretation of anything associated even vaguely with Trump that makes these people so despicable in our eyes. That, and the blatant refusal to get into a real discussion. The request to name all those killed on that day is tossed off as “moving the goal posts”. Well, yes, if asking for facts is moving the goal posts of Leftist lies. But it’s a legitimate question. I don’t remember the name of the woman who was savagely beaten over the head by a DC cop wielding a pole, with people begging her to stop, even after the woman was unconscious, but she was one of the two people killed that day. The other, of course, was unarmed Ashli Babbitt, who had not shown any violence and was in fact trying to crawl through a window to get away from violence, after begging people to stop being violent. (And if you can track down the video of that event you will see several of those she tried to deter from violence shoving jackets into trash cans and switching hats as they slunk away, trying to hide their participation in their false flag efforts.)

        You can sit at the feet of your idols and slaver over every lie they tell you, but don’t just lecture us that if we were to do the same we, too would learn the facts. If you had heard a single thing that could be verified you could tell us what it was.

      • fortyacresbeyond November 21, 2022 / 1:58 pm

        “The Left needs Trump.”

        The Left doesn’t need Trump, but if you’re going to keep serving him up, I see no reason why the Left wouldn’t take advantage of it. Trump has proven over and over that he causes elections to be lost.

      • Cluster November 21, 2022 / 3:14 pm

        So Forty, thank you for admitting that Trump DID NOT incite violence on Jan 6, in fact, he encouraged the opposite, leading you to cite detainees blaming him as the reason. That again is quite a reach. But maybe you could provide those “reckless words” that has your panties bunched up. Also do some homework on the number of FBI agents who infiltrated Proud Boys, dressed up as Trump supporters and marched on Capital grounds and entered the Capital. That should keep you busy for a while.

      • Amazona November 21, 2022 / 7:25 pm

        Wray would not only not answer questions about how many agents had infiltrated the crowds on January 6, he refused to say how many of them participated in and even instigated violence.

      • fortyacresbeyond November 21, 2022 / 3:52 pm

        “So Forty, thank you for admitting that Trump DID NOT incite violence on Jan 6, in fact, he encouraged the opposite, leading you to cite detainees blaming him as the reason.”

        Wow. You exposed me. Good job.

        As for those “reckless words,” you will have to read Mike Pence’s new book.

      • Amazona November 21, 2022 / 7:27 pm

        No, Punkin, if you have reckless words you can present them. You make your sweeping statements and when challenged all you can do is say “watch the hearing” or “read the book”. In other words, you basked in the illusion of fact, but can’t remember any of the actual details or words. It’s mindless nubs like you who enable the Left.

      • Cluster November 21, 2022 / 4:56 pm

        Well you seem to be the expert chief, so why can’t you recite the “reckless words”?? Also, I wouldn’t read anything Mike Pence wrote, but thanks.

      • Amazona November 22, 2022 / 12:14 pm

        I was always a real Mike Pence fan, till he folded on January 6. He simply misstated the law, to weasel out of having to take a stand, and possibly to avoid being seen as a Trump supporter. A stronger man could have, would have, stated that the irregularities seen in the voting and counting made it imperative to look further into the claims, and give states time to revisit their decisions to certify their state tallies. This would not have been a pro-Trump position, but a pro-America position, and he didn’t have the backbone to do it. That is when he lost my support forever, and since then I have seen him as wishy-washy and untrustworthy. I can’t believe he is considering a run for the presidency.

      • Cluster November 22, 2022 / 4:47 pm

        Agree 100%. There was similar situation with Pence when he was Governor, I can’t remember the details but he folded to mob pressure back then too.

      • fortyacresbeyond November 22, 2022 / 4:01 pm

        “No, Punkin, if you have reckless words you can present them.”

        Oh sweetie, “Reckless words” is a direct quote from Mike Pence’s book. As in he writes, Trump’s “reckless words had endangered my family and all those serving at the Capitol.”

        Regarding Trump’s 2:24 tweet saying Pence “didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done,” Pence writes, “I just shook my head. The truth was, as reckless as the president’s tweet was, I really didn’t have time for it. Rioters were ransacking the Capitol. … The president had decided to be part of the problem. I was determined to be part of the solution. I ignored the tweet and got back to work.”

      • Cluster November 22, 2022 / 4:50 pm

        Well I guess cowardly men don’t like to be called cowardly. And to the cowardly that’s an attack I suppose. What Pence meant to say was “I ignored the tweet and did exactly what the ruling class wanted me to do. To hell with the American people”.

      • Amazona November 23, 2022 / 10:06 am

        Blah blah blah. I say I have no respect for someone and you say I should read what he said. And these “reckless words” were not even alleged to be incitement of the violence, just an indictment of Pence’s spinelessness. “didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done,” is a “reckless” statement? Poor baby.

        The smug self-congratulation of Pence as he nobly announces his intention to be “part of the solution” pretty much sums up my new disdain for him. I notice he doesn’t seem to consider his folding under pressure to be the nexus of the problem. f he wanted to be part of the solution he should have stood up for postponing certification until an investigation could have been started, but he didn’t have the courage to do that. He wanted to play Pontius Pilate and then “be part of the solution” to the problem he created.

        Think about it. What if Pence HAD acted responsibly, stood up to the howling mobs, said he would not put his own name to the certification until the situation had been examined, even suggested that the legislatures which had certified tallies proven to be uncertifiable might want to revisit their decisions? Well, the real Trump supporters would not have hung around the Capitol. leaving the rioting to the professionals and the agitators and the infiltrators, making it a lot harder to blame Trump and his supporters and undermining the whole false flag effort. The Left would have had its typical meltdown, and Pence would have been able to stand up as a true hero, instead of a timid quisling trembling in the face of the mob. Congress would have been allowed to act like a serious legislative body instead of a puppet rubber stamp. The importance of actual certification would have been clarified. The country and the world would have seen what serious commitment to electoral integrity looks like.

        In other words, the outcome would have been quite different, and probably not worked out as well for the Left as it did.

        When you consider the role Pence played in the whole mess, no wonder he is so eager to try to rewrite history and come across as something other than an empty suit who couldn’t do his job when challenged.

    • Amazona November 20, 2022 / 11:28 am

      WHA????? You mean there are actually governing bodies who understand that you can’t certify an election if you don’t know who got how many votes?

      We should send this to Mike Pence and every state that “cerfified” the 2020 election results they were given. while knowing they were not accurate.

      • Mark Noonan November 21, 2022 / 5:38 pm

        Latest I saw was Mohave also refusing to certify.

        We don’t know at the moment whether actual voter fraud in the form of ballot-box stuffing occurred…but the widespread election day problems in heavily-GOP precincts shows an incompetence so great that we must assume that it was nefarious. There is probably not much we can do about it – a revote simply won’t happen (I doubt that any jurisdiction in the USA has such a thing written into law) and the votes which exist are the votes which exist.

        The real action is now in the AG race – where the GOPer wound up 510 votes behind. If the recount and other efforts can possibly alter that, then we could get a GOP AG who would be committed to a real investigation of what happened. Probably not even a 1 in 100 chance of that, though. The only chance is that I’ve heard that the Democrats “cured” some ballots after the deadline, claiming that the voters in question agreed to cure their ballots before the deadline but couldn’t make it in time…which is bullsh** on stilts, of course. Absent a GOP AG, only the Legislature can help here – and we just gotta bet there are enough GOP squishes in it to prevent a real audit of the vote.

    • Tim November 20, 2022 / 8:23 pm

      Here’ is something for your viewing pleasure, that is if election denialism is your thing.

      • Cluster November 21, 2022 / 8:11 am

        Look at all those election deniers !!! Oh the horrors.

  2. Jeremiah November 19, 2022 / 2:51 am

    As far as hanging drug dealers as a deterrent to other drug dealers, that really won’t matter. What matters most is that you prevent that person from ever killing any more people with their drugs. You prevent that person from destroying any more families. That to me is worth it to end the life of and dispose of a drug dealer. So, on that front, yeah I agree with President Trump, too. These drug cartels are ruthless people, it’s like it doesn’t phase them to cut up a human body into pieces, and it really doesn’t. Just like it doesn’t bother an abortion provider to cut up a human body. The drug dealers and the abortion industry are our modern day holocaust.

    We’ve got some serious evil in this country that needs rectified.

    You know, I was reading the comments in the previous thread where y’all were talking about CRT. Isn’t that where the term “Woke” arose from? And you know, I got to thinking…this “woke” ideology that’s come about … Hitler he was woke, he was against the Jews. Margaret Sanger she was woke she was against blacks. And now this new woke faction of society is against whites, trying to exterminate the white people. There’s a pattern you see. Ultimately they want to destroy family, and set themselves up as God. Just like they’ve married science to politics and want everyone to bow down to their opinions rather than the truth.

  3. Cluster November 19, 2022 / 6:22 pm

    Here’s Fielding and Forty wishing Vlody best wishes. I hear they’re also sending out a strongly worded letter.

  4. Cluster November 20, 2022 / 8:37 am

    This is what happens when you try and steal an election in Brazil

    • Retired Spook November 20, 2022 / 9:41 am

      In this country we put people in solitary confinement for doing that. Let that sink in.

  5. Retired Spook November 20, 2022 / 9:43 am

    Your laugh for the day:

    • Cluster November 20, 2022 / 9:51 am

      Love it. Can they work from home??

      • Retired Spook November 20, 2022 / 10:36 am

        eHambergers — sounds delicious.

  6. Cluster November 21, 2022 / 9:40 am

    It’s strongly advised that Forty, Fielding, and Casper do not read the article linked below. It may shatter their carefully controlled narrative. Never forget, when it comes to inciting political riots, burning down federal buildings, infiltrating opponents political causes, promoting false narratives, stealing elections, and now voter suppression – the Democrats are professionals. As you read the article, keep in mind, Katie Hobbs is the official in charge of conducting and over seeing AZ elections.

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